User talk:Dr ishmael/Archive 8

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This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.


Need for SMW 1.9?

I can't get #subobject to parse with the | delimiter in a template or with #arraymap to set Record properties.--Relyk ~ talk < 01:24, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

Uh... give an example of what you're trying to do? I don't understand from your description. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 02:00, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
User:Relyk/sandbox/Sandbox2--Relyk ~ talk < 02:03, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
Yep, looks like that's a problem. But why do you need to assign multiple values to a record property anyway? —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 03:22, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
Testing for semantic subobjects for drop tables. It's also need for a multiple Has item cost properties on vendor subobjects. With that, we can simply have multiple cost parameters liked I asked in a previous section, so it's not really important to get 1.9, but convenient.--Relyk ~ talk < 05:47, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
I can't think of any other way to store and query the entries other than subobjects with multiple record entries, can this be requested?--Relyk ~ talk < 08:59, 7 December 2013 (UTC)
SMW 1.9 hasn't been released yet. But I don't think you need it anyway, at least not for vendor cost. Because you'll only have a single entry per currency, you could set up something like this:
{{vendor thingy|Item name|cost=5 coin,250 ecto}}

= Template:Vendor thingy =

{{#arraymap:cost|,|@@@|{{#var:{{#explode:@@@| |2}}|{{#explode:@@@| |1}}}}
| Sells item = {{{1}}}
| Has vendor cost = {{#if:{{#var:coin}}|{{#var:coin}};coin}}
| Has vendor cost = {{#if:{{#var:ecto}}|{{#var:ecto}};ecto}}
| Has vendor cost = {{#if:{{#var:karma}}|{{#var:karma}};karma}}

That's basically what Template:Recipe does for ingredients. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 17:15, 7 December 2013 (UTC)
That won't work because the currency can be any token. I'd implement a cost2 and cost3 parameter like recipe.--Relyk ~ talk < 21:16, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
Then that's even more like the recipe template.
{{vendor thingy|Item name|cost1=5 coin|cost2=250 ecto|cost3=100 Token X}}

= Template:Vendor thingy =

| Sells item = {{{1}}}
| Has vendor cost = {{#if: {{{cost1|}}} | {{#explode:{{{cost1}}}| |0}};{{#sub:{{{cost1}}}|{{#pos:{{{cost1}}}| }}}} }}
| Has vendor cost = {{#if: {{{cost2|}}} | {{#explode:{{{cost2}}}| |0}};{{#sub:{{{cost2}}}|{{#pos:{{{cost2}}}| }}}} }}
| Has vendor cost = {{#if: {{{cost3|}}} | {{#explode:{{{cost3}}}| |0}};{{#sub:{{{cost3}}}|{{#pos:{{{cost3}}}| }}}} }}

Still no need for setting multiple values of a record property on the same line. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 21:34, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
I already know that, I mentioned it on your talk months ago but never got around to implementing it. I'm only trying to convince of the need. I guess we'll manage without it.--Relyk ~ talk < 21:46, 8 December 2013 (UTC)

Deletion discussion

“sorry Alex - this is early beta interface, only a tiny bit of actual map - it's useless”

So instead of discussing this, we just delete stuff when someone disagrees? Ignoring the reasons here, I think deletion disputes should be actually discussed as the tag suggests. Especially when the deletion tag was actually added on the very same day while we usually reserve at least three days before deleting. poke | talk 13:26, 3 December 2013 (UTC)

But... there was no discussion. That particular image should've been reuploaded with .jpg extension anyway, so deletion is reasonable. As for "do we need to reupload it" - I don't think there should be maps for static NPCs that stand in the heart of the city anyway. MalGalad 13:38, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
This was more a comment regarding the general case, not this specific image which deletion might or might not be justified. poke | talk 13:57, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
I don't think there is a "general case" to be considered here - I normally consider deletions case-by-case. And in this case, I decided that the image was completely useless, and the wiki would be better served by having a redlink (which says "we don't have anything here, you can fill it in") than by having a crappy image (which says "this is what we got, deal with it"). I did consider Alex's removal of the delete tag, but I also know that he doesn't own the game, so he probably didn't realize just how useless the image was. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 15:10, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
I somehow managed to not see this conversation, the image was tiny when I think about it + dr ishmael's assertion was entirely correct that it was useless. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 12:27, 7 December 2013 (UTC)

MD5 sum

Hey Ishmael, so I'm making that tooltip, I'd like to know how are image pages with whitespaces treated by mediawiki md5 sum? Is "Confusing Images" treated just like this, or is it "Confusing_Images"? I'm trying to get the right md5 but I'm constantly failing, do you have eyes on mediawiki's source? -- 01:24, 8 December 2013 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure this is the line where the "name" of a title is set: [1] (had to track back from includes/specials/SpecialUpload.php through about 10 other files >.> so hopefully I didn't get lost). As you can see, it does replace spaces with underscores. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 02:04, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
I see. I need the correct md5 sum to find an image direct url, it takes first digit then two first digits like this: for md5=f9ra, the path is images/f/f9/image.png. But I can't get the correct results in Javascript, even when enabling UTF8 encoding, not sure if it's the image name's md5 or the file itself, but it isn't retrieving the correct sum. :( -- 02:09, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
I got it to work using [2] on File:User Dr ishmael chicken icon.png. The title does not include the namespace, so I performed the MD5 on User_Dr_ishmael_chicken_icon.png and got ad66..., which matches the file's path: Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 02:15, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
No, wait, really? Is that really because I wasn't appending ".png" to the string? Man... *stabs self*. Lemme check. -- 02:23, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
Well, that solved the issue. I replaced whitespaces for underscores and appended ".png", then it generated the correct MD5 sums for all of the images I was checking (Confusing Images, Bane Signet, and Fireball), I may have additional issues with quotation marks (e.g. "Salve Yourselves!"), but it'll be simpler to address. Thanks a lot, Dr. Ishmael! *hands midnight cookie* -- 02:28, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
Yay, cookie! —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 02:34, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
In case you're wondering (or maybe you're not heh), I will not link every skill image through the tooltip, the design is better without images, but the variables icons are needed (damage, radius, torment, bleeding, combo, etc). I can have these preset images in a single file and use CSS to map each one (using selectors and such), but I have a major issue that made me put MD5 in the script: signets and effects alike. The variable icon (skill fact's image param) is the same as the skill, so I have to pull it from somewhere or store at a single image, but the latter is impossible since I can't predict how many skills will follow this same irregular icon usage. So it comes down to some exceptions (like signets), I'd prefer if ArenaNet wouldn't use the skill's icon (the "open book" misc would be fine), but they chose it. :P -- 02:42, 8 December 2013 (UTC)

Would it be possible to make it standard?

Skill effects! So many different formats, some don't make sense with the ever-useful MISC. Is it possible to replace {{quickness}} and the like with {{skill fact|misc...? With <alt>, <pre> and <suf> the sky is the limit, so why so many bad variations? (they're evil to parse in the tooltip, actually some can't be parsed >.>) – Valento msg 16:15, 8 December 2013 (UTC)

Point me to a specific example. {{skill fact|quickness|<duration>}} is how it should be standardized. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 17:06, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
I looked very quickly, but this is one single example:
Hope I didn't break it, now I can parse it and the other template's purpose was just to display the icon, not to be used in skill fact. – Valento msg 19:58, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
Ah, I see. Something I'd thought of in the past, and it came back to me now, is to make a "self" option that would automatically use the skill's icon and name, e.g. {{skill fact|self|<duration>}}. Dunno when I'll find time to do that, but it would help out a lot (on the wiki, anyway) with eponymous effects like that. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 20:49, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
I think some effects with same icon as the skill use {{{2}}} parameter as a simple value (no need to append " s"), like passive effects of signets. Not sure however if it would be really needed, just correcting a few cases with "misc" would do it. – Valento msg 23:47, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
Weee! It displays initiative cost now. :) – Valento msg 05:06, 9 December 2013 (UTC)
User:Relyk/skill effect, I already made it.--Relyk ~ talk < 05:26, 9 December 2013 (UTC)
You're a bit late. :P – Valento msg 11:33, 9 December 2013 (UTC)
Look at it closer.--Relyk ~ talk < 13:13, 9 December 2013 (UTC)

Big icons

How do you get those really big icons for weapons and things? All the Kodan Weapon icons are out of date, or perhaps were never right in the first place, but the only icon I can get from the game is like half the size of the ones you come up with. Psycho Robot (talk) 00:17, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

Have you noticed the "Icon archives" section on my userpage?  ;) Now, finding the specific icon you want can be a bit of a chore (there are over 6,000 64x64 textures, which are mostly item icons), but normally you could use the API to make it easier. For any given item, like Apple, you use the item ID to query the API, and within the result data is the icon's file ID - this maps to the icons in my archives, so you can go straight to the specific file. (Don't worry about the icon_file_signature field, that's for accessing the file on Anet's CloudFront site if you don't have the Gw2.dat files like I do.)
Unfortunately, it looks like dungeon weapons don't show up in the API. There are a few classes of items like this - mostly those obtained from non-coin vendors. However, the PvP versions are listed in the API, and they have item IDs 31632 - 31650. You can query the API for the PvP versions and find out their icons, and hopefully they're the same as the PvE versions. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 00:26, 15 December 2013 (UTC)
If it is of concern to you, the following are redirects/duplicates that could be deleted:
[[:File:Royal Ascalonian Axe.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Dagger.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Mace.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Pistol.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Scepter.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Sword.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Focus.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Torch.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Shield.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Warhorn.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Greatsword.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Hammer.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Longbow.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Rifle.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Staff.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Speargun.png]][[:File:Royal Ascalonian Harpoon.png]]
OK BYE Psycho Robot (talk) 03:21, 16 December 2013 (UTC)
BOOM —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 03:26, 16 December 2013 (UTC)
Great. one more thing to bug you with: the automatic stat lookup isn't working for Linen Gloves. I put the prefix in but the attributes and defense isn't coming up. Why is that? How do i fix? Psycho Robot (talk) 04:27, 16 December 2013 (UTC)
You don't have a level listed in the infobox. If the item doesn't have a required level, you'll have to enter the stats manually. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 04:48, 16 December 2013 (UTC)
This is sort of related to big icons. I have a question about smw and subobjects. How do I get the gives attribute bonus properties into the dungeon equipment template, such that they will show up whenever I make a query like on my user page? Psycho Robot (talk) 19:23, 18 December 2013 (UTC)
Constructing a subobject programmatically (i.e. building the list of properties and values on-the-fly by deriving them from input parameters, rather than using the input directly) is pretty difficult. Because attributes and their values are derived from other properties (type, level, rarity, prefix), there's no need from a data standpoint to annotate them in the first place: all the necessary information is contained in the other properties. You just have to do a little more work on the output side to utilize that information and derive the attributes (through template:item stat lookup and template:prefix attributes). —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 20:19, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

Ascended armor set nav

Seeing as you just finished creating all the ascended pieces with their own navs linked to be not constructed... (well done), I thought I might point out Talk:Ascended armor#Inter-piece nav templates. Would you much prefer to use individual navigators, or would a bot run to replace those with {{ascended armor nav}} be appropriate? -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 07:53, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

I was just mirroring the ascended weapons. Your idea is better, I'll run a bot shortly. (p.s. I modified the variable definition to match how I did it here because of the "Wei Qi's" set.) —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 14:22, 19 December 2013 (UTC)
unlucky on the fix. I've applied a much lazier fix instead. thanks for botting them along. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 15:10, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Ascended trinkets

So, Syzygy only shows the attributes of the amulet itself, not the included "upgrade", so the values on the overview page are correct, but that one is off. Any thoughts on how to get around this? Would it be best to have some sort of "upgrade" set? Or would it be better to have a suffix? --JonTheMon (talk) 17:15, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

For now we should set the variables explicitly (old fashion) instead of giving it a prefix. I don't know if there's any easy way to make it work well with the stat lookups. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 17:37, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

Hi, this SMW stuff is confusing ^.^

I've been moving every "Blood is Power" related page to its correct place (Blood Is Power), but some pages aren't right, would you mind checking or pointing me on how to fix them? – Valento msg 01:26, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

I know that after you move stuff you have to blank the page, save it, then undo it, to force SMW to update... beyond that I cannot say. Psycho Robot (talk) 01:30, 24 December 2013 (UTC)
It didn't work. – Valento msg 01:37, 24 December 2013 (UTC)
there were two text links i.e "Blood is Power", those needed changing. One was referred to in a template and the page needed force updating i.e. edit with nothing changed and a period in the comments (that's what I do at least). That fixed all the links except those on User pages. I let the redirect pick those up as some people don't like their user pages editing. yeah, it's confusing… --Claret (talk) 02:05, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

halp pls

I made a template to contain items which are sold in different variations by different vendors like Tamini Axe. Much to my surprise it seems to be working well on User:Psycho Robot/Sandbox, but the item stat lookup on [[User:Psycho Robot/Sandbox/merchant equipment table]] failed. I assume its because I tried to use ifeq in the middle of it, but I dunno. Can you halp pls? Psycho Robot (talk) 03:02, 26 December 2013 (UTC)

Actually, your problem is this:
<includeonly>|- {{item stat lookup|type={{#var:type_std}}|level={{{2}}}|rarity={{rare}}{{#ifeq:{{#var:met_supertype}}|armor|{{!}}class={{#vardefineecho:armor_weight{{!}}{{ucfirst:{{#explode:{{#var:defense_lu}}{{!}} {{!}}0}}}}}}|}}}}
The template named "rare" does not exist. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 03:08, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
Also you don't need to conditionally pass the "class" parameter - just remove the #ifeq and always pass it. If the type is not an armor, the item stat lookup ignores the class parameter. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 03:10, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
oh... that makes it a lot easier. I will do that. Psycho Robot (talk) 03:13, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
I have encountered another issue! I filled in the table with spam to make sure that it worked properly with multiple items, but for some reason one and only one of the weapon strengths failed to display. I'm really confused because... if it worked for 3 of them I see no reason why it shouldn't work for that single one of them. What say you to this perplexing issue? Psycho Robot (talk) 03:20, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
I figure it out... in my spam i specified a level 11 masterwork item, but masterworks can only be found 12+. Man I keep trying to have a technical problem, but instead its just me being stupid over and over. Psycho Robot (talk) 03:26, 26 December 2013 (UTC)

Zone maps with locator outlines on

Evening. Is there a page where you documented how you painstakingly mapped out the area borders for the zone maps? (I'm beginning to wonder if they're accurate enough to use when attempting to make the map objectives (wp/vistas/poi/skillc/hearts) consistent - I just seem to be finding quite a few inconsistancies between articles + the maps.) -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 19:02, 26 December 2013 (UTC)

I did explain what I did somewhere, but I don't remember where offhand. However, you can trust my maps.
  • PoIs/vistas/waypoints within an area only appear when you discover that area. Since I was taking screenshots of each area as I discovered it, I have (had? I probably deleted all of them) proof of PoI/vista/waypoint placement.
  • Hearts appear when you enter their range or when you talk to a scout, and all skill points are visible by default. While I don't have clear proof like above for these, most of them are obviously within a certain area. When I was plotting a border that ran over a skill point or heart, I would travel back to it in-game and verify the area name shown on the minimap, then draw the border appropriately to contain it in the correct area.
Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 19:07, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
Oh yeah, see the "Cartography" section on my userpage? I had meant to go through every single area/objective page on the wiki and validate/correct the information, but as you can see I only got through two zones before losing interest. So apologies, I suppose. ^^; —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 19:21, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
well no worries, when armed with locator maps, the map leaflet and smw I'll work out most of it! 00:23, 27 December 2013 (UTC)

Skill Infobox: Requests

Hi Dr. Ishmael, I've got quite a few things I'd like to talk about with you.

As you know I am making that javascript that pulls data from here and parse the template to create a tooltip, the tooltip is very dependent of the template structure and while the template wasn't created to have information in a relational fashion, the script needs relations well-specified or I will have to sensibly increase requests to the wiki (which is bad depending on where/by whom the script will be used). I got two issues by now which, hopefully, won't be too difficult to address:

1. Stealth Attack skills: The tooltip doesn't know which skill a certain stealth skill belongs to, and also if one skill got a stealth skill (no relationship whatsoever). For example, I don't know which skill Tactical Strike belongs to, neither if Slice got a stealth skill.
Solution: Simply add a 'stealth-skill' parameter to Skill Infobox so I can specify at each "root main skill" if it has a stealth skill associated, and sets the stealth skills' 'parent' skills.
2. Turret skills: Template lacks information at different levels here. Simple tool belt skills will have a brown arrow indicator showing its "tool belt chain" in the tooltip, turrets however can have two tool belt skills depending whether it's deployed or not AND one sequence skill. I'll present the layout I'll be using in the tooltip and where the info is lacking:
Healing Turret tooltip:
Healing Turret (parent skill) => Regenerating Mist (tool belt)


Cleansing Burst (parent skill - deployed turret) => Detonate Healing Turret (tool belt)
  • Missing Detonate Healing Turret (no parameter specifies the page name)
Cleansing Burst:
Healing Turret -> Cleansing Burst => Detonate Healing Turret
Regenerating Mist:
Healing Turret => Regenerating Mist
Detonate Healing Turret:
Cleansing Burst => Detonate Healing Turret
  • Parent skill listed as main parent skill (Healing Turret) instead of immediate predecessor (Cleansing Burst)
Solution: First, set a certain deployed turret's tool belt's parent skill to be its immediate predecessor (if you think about it, it makes more sense either way, Detonate Healing Turret is only possible through Cleansing Burst). Second (and most difficult to conceive), add a 'tool belt 2' parameter and sets "Detonate Healing Turret" there so I know where I can get this data from.

I would appreciate a lot if it was possible to apply these small changes, they won't affect many pages after all and won't really mess anything (the simple fact of having them there addresses relationship issues). You can test Smack, Ether Bolt, etc. here, it's not final specially the chain because I need more solid ways to retrieve data and it's lacking by now.

I'll be waiting on your response. :) – Valento msg 00:43, 27 December 2013 (UTC)

A stealth skill belongs to a specific weapon, and it's always in slot 1 - there's no need for an explicit relationship between it and the normal slot 1 skill (which is a chain in the case of dagger, anyway, which would make things really messy).
Detonate skills, yeah, I can understand why they should be changed to list the deployed skill as their parent. (edit: DONE.) I don't understand why anything else would be necessary? —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 01:24, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
Nice (1/4)! When I use mediawiki's API do query data I ask for as minimum of information as possible because I don't want to send too many requests to the wiki, it may also take longer to generate the tooltip for users if a site/forum makes use of this script. When I request data about Slice for example, I need to know what its stealth skill is because it's skill #1 but the template doesn't contain such parameter ('stealth-skill' for example), therefore I can't build the chain because I don't know where it comes from, actually it's not a chain, it's more like an indicator, so this one would pass by.
Turrets on the other side, when generating Healing Turret's tooltip I need all info I can get about ramifications. Luckily it's all perfect EXCEPT that I don't know what is Cleansing Burst's F1 equivalent (i.e. its tool belt skill). As it's an useful information to compose various skills' trees (i.e. sequences, chains, what skill A leads to, etc) I miss this little piece of information (Detonate Healing Turret), that's because it has no meaning for visualization purposes but it has a strong meaning relationship-wise (Detonate Healing Turret IS related to Cleansing Burst that IS related to Healing Turret, therefore Detonate Healing Turret has an indirect relationship with Healing Turret and thus it's valuable to show it in Healing Turret's tree).
I wish I could express myself better. :( – Valento msg 01:38, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
After thinking this through a lot I decided it's fine as it is now. I'll build sequence chain according to what wiki has to give, the only thing that I'll really miss in the tooltip will be stealth skill in parent skill, that would come as a good information there (I've even added a special css rule to display stealth skills in a nice way). Would you mind thinking this over to consider including stealth skill parameter? Thanks for all the help! :) – Valento msg 11:12, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
You should be able to identify a skill as a stealth skill by the Stealth Attack skill type right?--Relyk ~ talk < 17:17, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
Here's a thought - is there any way you can cache the skill data within your JS? The data doesn't change very often, so storing it locally would be much more efficient than querying the wiki every time you build a tooltip. Write a Perl/Python script to query all skills from the wiki and (re)build your JS data structures, and just run it whenever there's a game update. It'll be a sizable download whenever someone first visits your site, but like I said, it'll make the tooltips build a lot quicker than waiting on API calls to the wiki every time. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 17:27, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
Have you been reading my e-mail inbox? lol That's exactly what I was talking to a friend today - have the tooltip cached. Automate a 2-week script to gather, parse and cache the information then just read through all wiki-links with class, say, "gw2skill" and load them in the respective page.
@Relyk: I know if a skill is stealth attack, but I don't know if skill X has a stealth attack. I know because I play the game, but there's no information in the wiki.
Btw, do you guys think they'll come up with skill support in their API? – Valento msg 22:43, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
I'm not very comfortable to show the tooltip yet, but I'd appreciate if you just take a look at how it is as of now. Since I suck many times at web programming I still got to work through the whole script/css to check for incompatibilities, it's possible the script will not support IE6 and below. :) – Valento msg 19:42, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
Frankly, I wouldn't waste any time worrying about IE 6 - there's no reason whatsoever that people can't upgrade to a sane version of IE. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 19:45, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
Yeah... I'm very newbie when it comes to web programming specially these incompatibilities, what I know is how to search my way around solutions and work for it to be the best I can develop (although it may turn out monstruous :P). When you're testing cross-browser compatibility, do you test on every IE or is there such an online tester?
Btw, this is the new home for cached version of the script. – Valento msg 19:49, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
There are services like that provide screenshots of how the page renders in different browsers, but in order to test interactivity, you basically have to have the browser installed locally. I still wouldn't worry about much beyond Firefox and Chrome current builds (since they self-update) and IE 10. Maybe IE 9 if you have easy access to it, but anyone using older versions of IE really should upgrade just for the security fixes.
The tooltips look pretty good, although I'd do something about the stack numbers - they're difficult to read, especially on Healing Rain where it's overlaid on a bright-gold boon icon. I would also suggest that you use the original game textures, rather than using the wiki's tango icons, mostly because I don't think the tango icons work well outside the wiki. For weapon skills, showing the skill slot would be nice, and for elementalist weapon skills, showing the attunement (even though you can usually tell from the icon's coloring) would be even nicer. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 20:00, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
Weapon slot+attunement highlight applied. You know, I don't really know what color is better suited for stacks... colors contrast differ greatly depending on background icon, I found Healing Rain to be the only evil that messes up with white thus far, I'm afraid folks will miss the stacks information on this one. :S
Regarding skill fact icons... I love the tango icons actually, they're so simple and seems to have a better contrast with the tooltip as a whole. I may change them, but they fit so nicely within the tooltip. – Valento msg 21:06, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
What is type-link parameter here? – Valento msg 23:15, 1 January 2014 (UTC)
It's a deprecated parameter, I fixed it a bit back.--Relyk ~ talk < 02:26, 2 January 2014 (UTC)
Hey, take a look here and tell me what you think about skill chaining trees. I've set up them very customizable! :D – Valento msg 02:16, 2 January 2014 (UTC)
Why does some kit skills (Bomb) have 'backpack kit' slot? Does it even make sense? Also, would it be possible to remove 'tool belt' or 'tool belt skill' from type as one serve as alias for the other and these are engineer-specific, I take both are still there due to compability across the many documented skills? :) – Valento msg 03:54, 5 January 2014 (UTC)

Stupid issue and question

I know this is very minor, but my user page isn't working today. I think perhaps the wiki hasn't reset due to the new year? The code that stopped working is...

| valign="top" style="border:1px solid darkblue;" | {{#switch: {{#time:z}} | 1 = [[File:The Shattered Keep.jpg|500px|center]] | 2 = [[File:Dalin's Pumping Station.jpg|500px|center]] | 3 = [[File:Battlement Shore.jpg|500px|center]]

I was wondering if the day didn't reset to 1? Yoe Dude (talk) 19:21, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

According to the documentation, {{#time:z}} is 0-indexed (January 1 = 0). —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 20:17, 1 January 2014 (UTC)
Thank you once again for your help, changes made, it works. (I did say STUPID question =)Yoe Dude (talk) 20:25, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

Spiteful Documentation

I dunno man, as long as they're adding correct info, who cares what their motivation is? Personally, I find it hilarious. Also if editing the wiki out of spite is not allowed, then I suppose you ought to be banning me. Nearly all of my edits are with the intent to make Claret look bad. That arrogant bastard. I'll show 'em what for! I'll document every karma item in the game! Then who will look stupid, huh?! Psycho Robot (talk) 18:00, 6 January 2014 (UTC)

It's working, I am feeling really bad now and will have to seek counselling. --Claret (talk) 18:04, 6 January 2014 (UTC)
We don't document specific events for acquisition, we document the monsters in general that can drop the item. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 18:09, 6 January 2014 (UTC)
I'm not contesting the edit, I'm remarking on the edit summary. I say use the wiki for whatever petty vengeance you want so long as the info is accurate. We could embrace it even! "People richer than you got you down? Gimp their farms by telling everyone about them! That'll really give them the business... competition that is!" Psycho Robot (talk) 18:21, 6 January 2014 (UTC)
if pling were here, he'd give you a bollocking for using capitals in edit summaries. (oh I got so many warnings for infantile edit summaries on gww...) -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 18:43, 6 January 2014 (UTC)
DEAL WITH IT Psycho Robot (talk) 18:53, 6 January 2014 (UTC)
I did some looking in relation to this container, and I've discovered something significant. This is the tier 2 inquest container, dropped by foes from level 26 to level 35 (I'm estimating). However there are no inquest of that level anywhere in the world. There are no inquest for level 26-46, which covers the entire drop range for experimental materials, so they skip straight to provisional materials. Moreover, the only inquest that are level 25 are the ones located in brisban wildlands at Duskstruck Moors. There are only two events which take place in that area, Help U.N.I.T. find and destroy the Inquest and the Energy Core one which we don't have an article for. So he's actually 100% right. The only possible way to get these bags is to do those events with enough people to scale the mobs up to level 26. So in light of this information, should the specific events be documented? Psycho Robot (talk) 21:03, 6 January 2014 (UTC)
It's pretty clear that neither of them were being half as serious as this section would make it out to be (not that anyone here is being dead serious either, least of all me). Still, I'd like to note that Assume Good Faith is not a policy on this the same vein as judging content, not contributors, when it comes to mainspace articles. Why are they not policies? For the same reason nothing else is a policy here - we decided it was not necessary. When good habits are codified and enforced, they remind us of what to do, but also that we had need of a recollection in the first place. Vili 点 User talk:Vili 09:45, 10 January 2014 (UTC)
Reusing header because why not. Would you mind giving some input here? I figure its best to collect input since its concerning the format of like 300+ pages. Psycho Robot (talk) 03:35, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

Mystery of the transmutation stones

Can you take a look at this deleted page and see if it has any info at all about the Transmutation Stones that it is reported this chap sold at one point? Psycho Robot (talk) 03:19, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

{| {{STDT}}
| style="background: #C0C0C0; " | Name ||  style="background: #C0C0C0; " | Cost || style="background: #C0C0C0; " | Value
| [[Matlal Enchanted Pig Truffle]] ||  210 {{karma}} || 2 {{silver}} 40 {{bronze}}
| [[Tin Transmutation Stone]] ||  105 {{karma}} || 1 {{silver}} 20 {{bronze}}
| [[Iron Transmutation Stone]] ||  315 {{karma}} || 3 {{silver}} 60 {{bronze}}

Also see this old revision of Transmutation Stone. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 03:23, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
Interesting. I suppose its not really enough info to merit making pages for them though, right? Psycho Robot (talk) 03:27, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
I think it would be ridiculous to retroactively create pages for historical content, yes. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 03:28, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
But my historical content ;_; --Relyk ~ talk < 03:30, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
I found the chat codes for that ones 3 weeks ago lol So it's still ingame =P -- W.Wolf (talk) 04:29, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
Complete deletions from the item table are extremely rare - there are tons of weird things you can find if you play around with low-value item IDs and chat links. Doesn't mean we should document any of it, though. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 04:32, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
I know, just joking. There are really hundreds of it! -- W.Wolf (talk) 04:35, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
Could always make redirects for such pages (to either some generic Historical content or in-game later versions like all variations of Transmutation Stones going to Transmutation Stone) for if people go experimenting with links and goes "Oh! No page made for this item! *creates*".
As Relyk said "But my historical content ;_;" Konig 06:17, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
Can you please delete the redirect Swindler armor and move Swindler's armor back there? I made a mistake by moving it. Psycho Robot (talk) 03:56, 18 January 2014 (UTC)
Zort. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 04:10, 18 January 2014 (UTC)

Is it useful somewhere?

I just uploaded an image and I'm wondering where it would be useful to put to show what window pops up when applying an infusion to a 2-handed weapon.

User Valento Applying Infusion Upgrade To Staff.png
Valento msg 21:06, 26 January 2014 (UTC)

Crop it first, but it could go on Infusion. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 21:16, 26 January 2014 (UTC)

Events and API

I remember a while back you were able to determine that we were missing a dye based on the API. It turned out that the missing dye was a dummy entry used by dye remover so it was fine. However can you also determine if we're missing articles for events based on the API? Psycho Robot (talk) 02:04, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

You can check the event names API, but it only reports events that have actually triggered since the last reset. You won't find historical events there. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 02:32, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
What I'm hoping to do is do each event at least once to get any goodies that are only sold post-event, like Inquest Targeting Reticle. So will that not show events that need to be manually started, or does being put in "ready" mode count as triggering? Psycho Robot (talk) 02:51, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
I don't know. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 02:54, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
It depends on how the designer implemented it, it cn mean something else. I don't think the event API will be too reliable.--Relyk ~ talk < 03:56, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
It's very likely that the event has to go to Active status in order to be discovered, so that doesn't matter at all. The API is reliable. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 05:05, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
That's unfortunate, but oh well. Can you please move File:Seraph Medal of Honor.png to File:Seraph Medal of Honor (Seraph Soldier Goran).png without leaving a redirect? I need that file name. Psycho Robot (talk) 20:10, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
Moocher. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 20:11, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
I eagerly await more administrative handouts. Psycho Robot (talk) 20:12, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

API Insufficiency

I am unable to determine how to use the API as you suggest. It does not appear to have the capability to do what is required. For more information go here and please reply there as well. 1Maven (talk) 25-Feb-2014

Auto updating gem store?

Do you think it might be possible to automated the updating of items listed on the Gem Store article? (it is becoming increasingly difficult to synch it up with what's currently available, recently removed, and unlikely to return).

For our purposes, let's pretend that the relevant {{item infobox}} contains information that identifies: price (+ bulk prices), category, date introduced, date removed on, and (perhaps) sale price (and perhaps also the begin/end dates of the sale). The theory would be that if the infobox has accurate dates, the Gem Store article would automatically include the current items in the corresponding category and (if we wanted) display historical items on the sub page. I am hoping that this could work similar to {{recipe list by discipline}}.

Ideally, the page could also highlight (or have a special section for) things that are on sale (using a "on sale end date" parameter) or new (using a "date introduced" parm). However, the main goal would be to reduce the need to update multiple articles with the same bits of data.


Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 20:12, 28 January 2014 (UTC)

That would be possible, but it would require some detailed design work before implementing anything. You would also need to include the gem store description, since that rarely matches the item description. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 20:56, 28 January 2014 (UTC)

Category:Personal story images

File:Personal story mission complete.png laughs at your generalization--Relyk ~ talk < 21:48, 3 February 2014 (UTC)

Map borderline request

If possible, can you make one of your little area-borderlines map for Lion's Arch (well, there's six more maps needing it, I think, but LA is rather priority atm)? I'm not sure how you go about doing such otherwise I would if I got the chance. Thanks in advance! Konig 23:00, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, it's impossible for me to do the same thing for cities because the entire city is uncovered at once, not area-by-area like exporable zones. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 23:17, 15 February 2014 (UTC)
Dang... Well, I've been getting rough edges of areas from figuring out where NPCs lie in the areas. Maybe I can scrounge something up that way. I just need a good base image, and I don't like the current one that's up. How'd you get maps that are zoomed in and showing the full zone? If you can make a clean one with no Gendarran/Lornar/Claw Island/Bloodtide, I could probably scounge up what I mentioned (for the city borders I need those fogged). I've already gotten the borders of Sanctum Harbor figured out - as well as most of its bordering areas. Konig 23:42, 15 February 2014 (UTC)
Uploaded over File:Lion's Arch map.jpg. The city boundaries were the first things I did, since you can easily take a new character through all the cities without touching any zones (other than your tutorial area, but I just did a second character of a different race to get a clean boundary for that city). I just never bothered uploading images with them since there didn't seem to be much point. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 01:14, 16 February 2014 (UTC)
[[:File:User Konig Des Todes LA borders.jpg|Shoddy first attempt WIP]], using the one before your boundaries. It's a bit trial and error zig-zagging on the boundaries. Interestingly, a lot of the harbor boundaries are based on impassable terrain it seems. Haven't done between Western, Canal, and Eastern Wards or Grand Piazza, Sharkmaw Caverns, and Trader's Forum - also gotta check where Troll's End ends up (Western or Hooligan). Other than that, those lines are, more or less, in place. I'll update that image as I go later on today.Konig 01:25, 16 February 2014 (UTC)
I see you drew a line over the Sanctum Harbor Waypoint. When I did the explorable areas, I did fudge borders when necessary to clearly include map objectives within a certain area. Cf. File:Unbroken Expanse map.jpg, where the waypoint is in the northeastern corner, the actual border continued along the 45-degree line across the waypoint icon, but I drew the border around the icon to make it clear which area the waypoint was in. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 01:42, 16 February 2014 (UTC)
That was more due to the thickness of the line than intention. I meant to go just north of it and just west of it as that's what it is in-game - it's on the very edge of the area... hard to do. Konig 01:56, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

(Reset indent) I've gone and updated the link above. The lines should be accurate everywhere you can stand along the borders (obviously not certain beyond that but... not very important, right?). Since you're so much better at the map-making, think you can use that to make a better map than mine with the city zone borders? And whenever the update comes, no doubt the map will be changed to reflect the ruins, thus use the same borders for that (I cannot picture those changing, at least yet).
And I know I'm asking a bit but if you can also find the time to update the Kessex Hills map that would be fantastic. If you want, I can try to figure out the borders of the other cities too, just so we can get a completed series of these maps. Konig 22:01, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

Edit: and if you do such for the LA map, feel free to delete my user-image if you want, since it'll have run its purpose. Konig 22:03, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

Dumbledee doo

I actually haven't been on since the update. I assumed that it was still an unnamed landmark. Are we not supposed to include waypoints in POI/landmark pages? I thought we were, like in Diverse Ledges. Or did the waypoint go away? In any case, can you please move File:Lost Grotto.jpg to um.... [[:File:Order of Whispers Lost Grotto Base.jpg]] or something. I intend to upload an image that has more of the lost grotto than just the whispers base at the top. Psycho Robot (talk) 04:55, 22 February 2014 (UTC)

The waypoint was renamed to Postern Ward Waypoint and moved a bit south. In its place, a new Point of Interest (one of the two new ones) was placed over Lion's Shadow Inn, named after the old waypoint. And I don't think the image needs moving, just upload over it, unless you want to keep the old version too? In which case, I'd just upload at [[File:Lost Grotto 2.jpg]]. Konig 05:38, 22 February 2014 (UTC)
The reason why I made this request specifically was that the current image really doesn't show the lost grotto at all, only a very small portion of it that is not indicative to the overall ambiance, and therefore I felt that it was not appropriate as a "main image". Psycho Robot (talk) 21:34, 22 February 2014 (UTC)
In that same vein, I also request that File:Sharkmaw Caverns.jpg be moved to [[:File:Sharkmaw Caverns entrance.jpg]]. Psycho Robot (talk) 23:27, 22 February 2014 (UTC)
Landmarks, yes; PoIs, no. A PoI is by definition a point and cannot include other points, but a landmark can have whatever spatial representation it requires.
And I don't know why you're asking me about moving files, it's not like that requires admin privileges or anything. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 04:15, 23 February 2014 (UTC)
Cause I need no redirects left behind! Psycho Robot (talk) 04:20, 23 February 2014 (UTC)
Meh, I agree with Konig - just upload over them, then re-upload the old version to a different name. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 04:22, 23 February 2014 (UTC)
Yeah, you dingus, why do you spend so much time trying to convince people not to edit the wiki? You are just one giant obstacle to entry. Anyways, so this trip to your talk page is not a complete waste of time, I'm still a little bit confused about the distinction between landmarks and pois, and why landmarks can contain waypoints, but pois cannot. In Orr, there are loads of pois that correlate to an area which contains a waypoint, and that waypoint even has a name which is similar to the name of the poi, for example, Pact Rally Point has Rally Waypoint, Conquest Marina has Conquest Marina waypoint, and so forth. Is it your position that neither of those pois actually contain their related waypoint? By the way I know that Lion's Shadow Inn doesn't contain a waypoint by any stretch of the imagination, its that you presented it as an absolute that I find puzzling. Psycho Robot (talk) 02:31, 28 February 2014 (UTC)
A landmark, in wiki-speak, is a point or an area that cries out for a name but ANet have not given it one. A poi is a named point on the map, personally I give it a little latitude and let it have a little space around it especially if its name indicates that it should have one eg Xyz camp may be a poi but I will treat it, to some extent, as a very small area - although I know I should not. That's my take on it though I expect to be corrected. --Claret (talk) 05:03, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Template:Default item parameter GW2Spidy links

spidy links are an interesting idea + probably would be very favorably received by the community. (who put you up to this? cos its an awesome idea.) -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 16:23, 28 February 2014 (UTC) Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 16:35, 28 February 2014 (UTC)
I've also been considering adding API links, but I don't know how useful that would be for general users. We already have most of the recipe/item data on the wiki anyway, the only things missing would be the game_types array and the flags that don't deal with binding. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 16:51, 28 February 2014 (UTC)
Hmm the API links are a bit raw imo to link to. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 16:54, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Ascended Accessories

As you probably saw if you stalk the recent changes, and I have a feeling you do, I added ascended prefixes to the prefix lookup template. It worked perfectly for the rings, but for the accessories, it returns values 1 point too high. My theory is that, contrary to what Template:Item stat lookup/major attribute/accessory says, an ascended accessory's major attribute is 59 and not 60. However, since this affects more than just the pages that I'm actually looking at, I figured I'd ask you, is there a way to verify what the base value actually is, or is the only way to figure out the value to work backwards, subtracting the known values of the ascended upgrade component from the attributes of the entire piece? Psycho Robot (talk) 00:29, 2 March 2014 (UTC)

It's supposed to be 59, I had a math fail apparently. And the minor is supposed to be 42, not 43. You can see them split out in the API: [3] The inherent stats are in the "attributes" array, while the upgrade stats are given in the "buff" object. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 02:13, 2 March 2014 (UTC)
I am uncertain how to make celestial stats work with {{Prefix attributes}} in the case of back pieces. I verified the exotic stats myself, its +10 to all with +1% critical damage, and I asked some random guy in map chat about the ascended, he reported that it was +22 to all with +3% critical damage. Subtracting the +12 to all with +2% critical damage of the "buff" item, we realise that it has the same stats as the exotic. Do I add the values I found to Template:Item stat lookup/celestial nbr and [[Template:Item stat lookup/celestial pct]], then specify that its prefix is at celestial? Psycho Robot (talk) 04:22, 3 March 2014 (UTC)
That makes perfect sense with the tiny scaling you get on back items: ascended = exotic * 0.05, so you're not gonna gain even 1 point when you start with 10 (unless it had been rounded down from 10.49, but that's obviously not the case). I updated the templates for you. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 05:02, 3 March 2014 (UTC)

Hey now

Fitnesshotsex could be a legit user. Felix Omni Signature.png 05:19, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

Hello. My name is Fithotsexness. You killed my father. Prepare to die. Fithotsexness (talk) 05:23, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
Who let you out of my basement? Psycho Robot (talk) 05:29, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
Legit user? More like idjit loser, amirite? —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 13:21, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

An unlikely request

So there is a rather big project I want to get done, wanted to get done for a while actually, but I've been hesitant purely because of the sheer huge amount of redirects and tags of deletion it'd cause. I was wondering if I could, for even just a week or two, get the ability to suppress redirects for this project? I'm doubtful but I figured I'd ask just to make your and other sysop/admins/people-who-delete-stuff's lives a wee bit easier (and mine too). Konig 14:21, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

That's not something I can grant, you'd have to ask a bureaucrat. We have a "patrol" user group that has suppressredirect and rollback rights, but we haven't used it yet. (In fact, I don't remember Justin/Stephane telling us when they added this, but that's prolly just my bad memory.) I think this would be a great thing for users like you, Relyk, Psycho Robot, etc. who do a lot of work around here but don't exactly need full sysop tools.
I'll poke Poke, just in case he doesn't see this. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 15:03, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
sounds like a good idea, wish i'd thought of it. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 15:12, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
Can we give everyone suppressredirect? That was kind of my intention when I requested it to begin with. Pointless to keep it locked away in a usergroup nobody's in. -Auron 16:28, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
I think the last time that came up I stayed undecided about it, but now I agree with you - we should just add that to the autoconfirmed group. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 16:29, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
Along with suppressing redirects, moving over redirects should be equally common, IMO. It's really tedious when you have to wait for article deletion to move an article to where another once was... (e.g., what would have been the issue if Mordremoth and Giganticus Lupicus were moved properly). The preceding unsigned comment was added by Konig Des Todes (talkcontribs).
FYI, the autopatrol/patrol groups are from the german wiki. We've been using them to give people a little more permissions without making them sysops directly, mainly for RC patrolling things. A while ago, the permissions/groups for all wikis got merged, so you got them here, too. --Tera (talk) 14:10, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
That would explain why we didn't know about it. Thanks, Tera.
@Konig: No, that's not possible without making you a sysop. What that's actually doing is an automatic delete of the existing redirect before performing the move, thus it requires delete rights. If you tag them and then post on my or Alex's talk page, we'll get them cleaned up quickly. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 14:58, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
If we did successfully convince poke et al to add suppressredirects to the main trusted usergroup, would adding that also affect the settings on other wikis (such as the german wiki? ... or was it just added here because they thought it would be a good idea) -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 17:12, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
Every wiki has its own configuration, so no, it won’t affect other wikis. Btw. Alex, I would welcome if you didn’t hide comments within your edit summary. That being said: You probably didn’t see any problems because the use is simply restricted to sysops. Also, what is that “main trusted usergroup”? poke | talk 17:32, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
Well it was a worthy question given the precedent of the "patrol" usergroup appearing despite not asking for it. I was referring to "autoconfirmed", which is good enough for these purposes. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 18:31, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
Heya, the reason I personally objected having everyone being able to supress redirects for moves is because I fear it becomes the default. It occurs very often that a page is moved and the source page is instantly tagged for deletion. In many cases however, the redirect actually serves a purpose there though. And unless the page is taking the place for something else, or is just blatantly wrong, I don’t believe an additional redirect would actually hurt at all.
So for users having the ability to supress redirects immediately, my fear is that most moves will end up being done without a redirect, just to make it “less messy” although having a redirect would be helpful. I understand that there are good reasons for not creating redirects, e.g. fixing file names (as files are rarely externally accessed by name), but I still wouldn’t go as far as making it default for a large part of the users.
As for rollback rights, I’m actually not comfortable with giving it to too many users. Rollback is a very powerful function; it’s not just a one-click undo of the last revision, but instead it rolls back all latest edits from that user. And to make it worse, it unfortunately puts itself in very many locations where it just begs to be used by accident (especially recent changes).
So I don’t really know about whether we should use the patrol group for trusted users or not. I think I personally would rather see trusted users to take the step and get RfA’d, to ensure that they actually are entrusted by the community, and to serve as more than just users who can quickly roll back stuff (but can’t stop vandalism) and move stuff without making a redirect.
As for the Konig’s original request, things like “a rather big project” and “sheer huge amount of redirects and tags of deletion” makes me even more hesistant. If that project really involves that many redirects that the deletion process (btw. you could easily give sysops a list of deletion candidates too—no real need to tag them) would become a problem, then I would say that the project itself shouldn’t be executed as a normal user anyway. I would rather suggest making this a bot task instead. Btw. I see that bot activity has been stagnant for a while, but me having a lot more time starting today would certainly offer help. poke | talk 16:24, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
(Reset indent) "I would say that the project itself shouldn’t be executed as a normal user anyway. I would rather suggest making this a bot task instead." If you have a bot program that can check to ensure the file name to each individual Category:ArenaNet concept art is the original name or not (which requires looking out non-wiki sources, btw), and depending on that rename it into one of two file name formats, and then for the "not" case determine a file name dependent on what the image depicts, be my guest. But as far as I know, making a bot to do such a thing - if possible - would be so time consuming the project would be finished faster if by hand. A bot might be capable of speeding it up for any non-moving edits (read: deleting redirects made, re-categorizing if needed), but not really for the file moving themselves. Konig 17:37, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
There are about 16 users in the last 3 months that have moved a page, half have only moved one or two pages. Whether or not someone has patrol rights, if they suppress unnecessarily, someone will come along to leave a harshly worded message. I personally wouldn't be comfortable with going through RfA for privileges until I want to take on an administrative role. I would put it this way: Someone can be trusted by the community where an RfA is possible and only require patrol privileges.--Relyk ~ talk < 17:58, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
I don't think that I) administrator privileges and II) suppress redirects should be given the same weight of influence. Moving a page and not having another user run around behind them cleaning up things is a blessing for everyone involved. Its a simple thing and really does not need the wiki-approval on the same scale as RfAs do. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 18:36, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
Uhm no Konig, you misunderstood me. I wasn’t try to replace you on your project. The bot wouldn’t do your job. The bot would just replace you pressing the move button and entering the new name. You could still go through those pages, decide what you want to do, and instead of moving yourself, just create a list of moves… poke | talk 19:45, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
My point - I tend to be indirect about these things at times, odd thought process and all that - was that if I'm going to have to compare each individual image to check the name, quality of image, etc. then I might as well spend the extra 5 seconds per image to press "move" and enter the new article name, than to spend the time it would take to list each image and designate its destination so that a bot can then do it in 10 seconds for all of them. And considering I don't know how to write bots, that'd be the time it would take to write up the list for someone else to make the bot, the time it would take until said someone else saw the list, and the time it would take for said someone else to make the bot. By all that's said and done? It'd be faster and easier if I did the moving.
A nice graph to show what I mean. Though it's a joke graph. Konig 20:51, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
And I’m just saying that if you are worrying about the redirect deletion, then you should also already worry about the move in the first place. If you don’t, then the deletion won’t be an issue either. poke | talk 00:30, 8 March 2014 (UTC)
What I "worry" about more is taking time out of other people's days to do something so minor but ultimately time consuming. I got enough free time it doesn't bother me. I just don't like being a burden on others. Konig 00:48, 8 March 2014 (UTC)
Well, if you want to make this less of an issue, instead of tagging the pages you want deleted, make a list and put that somewhere. That should even save you some time too—given that you don’t need to add a tag somewhere, and you probably can get the page titles off your contribution list once you’ve worked off a batch of pages. poke | talk 02:51, 8 March 2014 (UTC)
@Poke: So? The entire point of the tool is being able to move pages without leaving redirects, and your concern is that people will move pages without leaving redirects? What.
The wiki community is small - the amount of contributors that actively move pages is tiny, and the potential for abuse is very low. When pages are moved and the old one deleted, logs show the page move - so anyone (presumably RC hawking, or something?) that finds the old article will be able to find the new page. In the case of an external link (a specific wiki page being linked by an external source), the vast majority of the time those won't get links updated in the 3-day window we currently have for standard deletions. Often they don't get updated at all, so if we're deleting the page immediately via suppress or in 3 days via the longer method, it has no impact (but because of that concern, well-trafficked pages moved might need redirects left behind permanently, and that can easily be dealt with on a case by case basis). I know your concerns, but I don't think keeping suppress redirect suppressed has a point. Give it to autoconfirmed users and see how it goes. If they totally fail with it or whatever we can change it, but I don't think that'll happen tbh. -Auron 03:06, 8 March 2014 (UTC)
I support making suppress redirect easier to access. I don't have a strong opinion of whether it should be given to autoconfirmed users, but people who demonstrate a need for it should be able to get it without being an admin. As relyk said, only a small amount of people use move, so it would seem only giving it to people who request it would be a good compromise. If they know enough to know to request suppress redirect, then they should also know enough to realise when a redirect is handy, and wouldn't go abusing it. Psycho Robot (talk) 04:03, 8 March 2014 (UTC)


Really? Really!? *facepalm* Meh, whatever. Inconsistencies let's go! (translation: same id != rename the article) Konig 14:44, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

In this case, the PoI refers to the same object in the same location, it's just in a different state of being. Maw's Rise/Marionette's Landing refer to the same location but with completely different bases in lore. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 14:48, 25 March 2014 (UTC)
Aware, though I feel, personally, that making one exception to make an easier consistency (there's also Gunnery Range v. Tenanera's Pit that shares this conundrum, though a different location sharing the same id), and moving the name results in a lot of redirect usages (which always bother me to the point of going and bypassing redirects whenever possible). There'd never be much complaint beyond having different states of history in multiple articles. Konig 15:01, 25 March 2014 (UTC)
"different states of history in multiple articles" We don't do that for NPCs that change over time, why do it for a construct like the Breachmaker? —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 15:21, 25 March 2014 (UTC)
Well, sans Kiel, do they have name changes on top of appearance changes? Well... okay, there's o-Tron.... Who needs to die in a fire. We'll make a bonfire with Scarlet's corpse and O-Tron and do some dances around it. Konig 15:58, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

File:Green World Citadel map.jpg

I was going to upload it, that's why I didn't do anything. Green World Citadel map is my 30th screenshot, I'm still a bit far away from it. You no give me time =P --W.Wolf (talk) 23:12, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

Weeeell shoot, partner, ah was only tryin' t'help. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 23:51, 27 March 2014 (UTC)


Aww, you’re such a party pooper :P (btw. if you add #2487# to any URL, it is also deactivated temporarily, so you can keep a usable RC open) poke | talk 01:23, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Saw that, tried it, but it doesn't persist when you click on the new timestamp link. Which I do a lot.
But this is a really good prank. :D Maybe I should start visiting IRC again...
[edit] Oh yeah! Is this in any way related to what I said in that email? Or was it parallel evolution? —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 01:37, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
You should definitely get on IRC more often again (I do that too now). And no, completely unrelated to the mails, which makes it even better. I did bring up the topic though, will send a mail about it tomorrow. poke | talk 01:42, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

3/10, would not laugh again. It's painful because it cuts too close to reality. (Skillfully done, I just find it tasteless.) Vili 点 User talk:Vili 01:44, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Don’t worry Vili, we’ll always stay independent. poke | talk 01:50, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
I think he was referring to a different connotation of the prank. Psycho Robot (talk) 01:56, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
Well, on that one, I quite like this comment. poke | talk 01:59, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
This prank happened on March 31st at 9 PM for me. That's 4 PM for Anet time. Fail. Konig 02:36, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
Wiki's always gone by UTC, not PST. Felix Omni Signature.png 02:47, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
Yes, that is basically why Vili is upset. I did know about Dulfy from previous games, but based on the great success of guildwiki and GWW, I thought we'd at least be able to compete modestly. Not to mention the whole "official" aspect, which has been well leveraged in the past. That train left the station a long time ago, though. At this point the wiki might as well be turned over to Dulfy - that's basically how I feel, and why this fool feels more like salting a wound than a funny joke. Vili 点 User talk:Vili 03:46, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
Well, compared to GW, GWiki, and GWW, GW2 and GW2W have been kind of a flop. When Dulfy first started covering GW2 (more accurately, when I first found out that Dulfy was covering GW2), I was torn between being offended and amused. After all, GWiki and GWW had the best team of documentarians I've ever seen in a fandom -- both wikis are mostly up to date even today, only significantly lacking in the walkthrough departments, thanks to an enormous team of editors, administrators, and back-end magicians. Other fansites simply paled in comparison, and the magnanimity of GWW and GWiki's success is even more apparent when compared to other fandoms (say, the Golden Sun and Binding of Isaac wikis).
I guess in my nostalgia I'd forgotten that GW2W is a different game with different developers and a different community. I'm not sure how exactly I'd forgotten -- those are some of the primary reasons why I uninstalled, after all -- but the fact remains that when GW2 came out, we traded some old blood for new blood. I've not been around a lot, but it seems like we lost more old blood than we gained new blood... and then we started losing some of the new blood as well.
I'm with Vili on this one. It just cuts too close.
And I know usability is secondary to the humor on April Fool's (see also: me falling for the Shadow Form buffs way back when), but damn, this shit is annoying.
--Armond 04:45, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
Way to turn an april fool's joke into a chance to complain about how the wiki is dying.--Relyk ~ talk < 05:12, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
Yeah, how dare you bring negativity to the wiki? Stop complaining all the time and just contribute. You oppressive knee-jerking old guard, you. Vili 点 User talk:Vili 05:38, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
Don't worry Rylek, he's just one of hundreds who would use any opportunity to complain and hate. Did I mention that I hate you? Cuz I do. I hate you, your mom, and your little dog too. Even if you don't have a little dog, I hate it too. I hate the non-existence of your dog, or the existence of it. Whichever is the case, I hate it. Did I mention that I hated you, too? Cuz I do. Konig 05:40, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
At least with this acquisition we are going to start receiving money and getting credit for every edit we do! Oh wait...--W.Wolf (talk) 14:51, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

I'm going to create a donation button in my user page. Part of the money is going to be used in my master's degree and the other part will go to charity. I'm only doing this to have more time editing gw2wiki without having to work and study at the same time. Thank you for all your contributions! Edit: I failed to create it. Tell me how to do it =P --W.Wolf (talk) 07:27, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Ask User:Chieftain Alex, he has plenty of time right now.--Relyk ~ talk < 19:28, 1 April 2014 (UTC)
Already asked him, he told me that you could help Relyk because he was too busy right now. --W.Wolf (talk) 20:06, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

crafting infobox

Since we have the recipe template, the only property unique to crafting is the tier, we should be fine with merging it with the item infobox. It can be useful to guarantee we need to query for recipes, but we can query for recipes anyways.--Relyk ~ talk < 17:27, 3 April 2014 (UTC)

Karma armor result table

Can you help me make a table where you input the armor set and the slot and it returns a list of matching items sold by karma vendors? What I have so far is

No results.

but I don't know how to add the description to the table, and I'd like to have the vendor and its location, (maybe with the price if its possible) but I don't know how to um... reverse lookup I guess? Plus, it's not showing the rarity, which I think means it's not looking at the subobjects, and I dunno how to do that either. Psycho Robot (talk) 23:04, 15 April 2014 (UTC)

You need to set Has armor set in the subobject. The properties on the pages for the f/m weapons have no meaning. And the karma vendors would need to implement the vendor subobject before you could query.--Relyk ~ talk < 23:20, 15 April 2014 (UTC)
Oh duh. I forgot about adding has armor set to the fm template. As for the vendor bit, is there any easy way to do that, or should I just plan on inputting that info in manually? Psycho Robot (talk) 23:27, 15 April 2014 (UTC)
I think most of karma merchants have the tables, only need to be converted to {{vendor table row}}--Relyk ~ talk < 23:31, 15 April 2014 (UTC)
Have you not been stalking my edits? I'm offended you're not extremely interested in me and my exploits. I mean you posted in your newsletter that I redirected celestial armor pages, and made doric's equipment... so I feel like you are kind of. I just spent liiiiike 3 months or so updating every single karma vendor's inventory table to use vendor table row. Psycho Robot (talk) 23:44, 15 April 2014 (UTC)

--Relyk ~ talk < 23:53, 15 April 2014 (UTC)

{{Karma armor vendor list}}. It is not very pretty at the moment since most of the vendors don't use the id parameter :( -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 01:36, 16 April 2014 (UTC)
Why create a new template instead of modifying {{vendor table}}?--Relyk ~ talk < 01:55, 16 April 2014 (UTC)
Neato. Is there any way to semi-automate switching the vendor table row from using manual info to using the id? hi ishmael. Psycho Robot (talk) 02:05, 16 April 2014 (UTC)
@relyk; hmm I've never used that template - possibly because even the example is horribly broken. The format I was going for was aiming to match the data provided by Duelist's armor#Acquisition. If this format is something we want to use on non-armor pieces, then maybe could merge them. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 02:11, 16 April 2014 (UTC)
@alex, queries involving vendor subobjects wasn't even intended until all the templates had been converted properly without issues. Sorry for providing an example at all. I wanted to figure out how we would map ids from vendor subobjects to items and item subobjects, how we link, and how to form the actual query.
@psycho, there's no logic branch required for id, it's all one query.--Relyk ~ talk < 02:20, 16 April 2014 (UTC)
@psycho (2); we can create a template to subst a semantic ask query along the lines of "#ask Has canonical name::X, Has item rarity::Y, ?Has game id#". I'll have a look when its not 3:25AM -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 02:24, 16 April 2014 (UTC)
I don't know what you mean, but you definitely don't have to do that.--Relyk ~ talk < 02:31, 16 April 2014 (UTC)
should be possible with AWB. what I have so far..
Find (regex):
$1{{subst:#if: {{#ask: [[Has canonical name::$4]][[Has item rarity::{{subst:ucfirst:$9}}]] | ?Has game id# | mainlabel = - | headers = hide | default = | searchlabel = }} | id = {{subst:#ask: [[Has canonical name::$4]][[Has item rarity::{{subst:ucfirst:$9}}]] | ?Has game id# | mainlabel = - | headers = hide | default = | searchlabel = }} | name = $4$5{{subst:!}} rarity = {{subst:ucfirst:$9}} }}$5
the query logic needs fixing per [4], but most of it worked. (not well enough to fully automate though). I think that we should arrange it such that the name of the item listed in the vendor list should match the canonical name though (which is the problem for anything with fmtable+co. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 10:07, 16 April 2014 (UTC)

Scouts on, or?

Just nosing at your user page and wondered why your table has "N/A" displayed under scouts for Straits, Malchor's and Cursed. They are there - I see'd them. Bored and at work, natch. — snogratUser Snograt signature.png 17:30, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

They're not linked to hearts, so there's no table of hearts to update. In any case, it's an old project that I dropped about a month after I started it, so I should probably remove that from my userpage. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 17:34, 17 April 2014 (UTC)
Aha, I shall rest easy now. I mean "resume working" easy. — snogratUser Snograt signature.png 17:36, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

SMW annotation of description in item infobox

hmm, I suppose you recall our comments on Property talk:Has game description thinking that it would be a good idea to add SMW annotation to the description parameter in item infoboxes? Well it turns out it kind of broke the description for all of the food pages since they use {{nourishment}} in the description - it ends up printing the table formatting as plaintext ><

My thoughts are that nourishment needs moving to the variables part of the template. alternatively we could revert the annotation change, or just turn it off for Has item type=Food. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 18:17, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Nourishment should be a new parameter for the infobox, there's no need for that template to be explicitly used as part of a parameter value. Unlike the multi-use templates we use for variables, nourishment only appears once, so it can be moved into the infobox template. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 18:20, 17 April 2014 (UTC)
You would need two parameters, one for the duration and one for the nourishment facts. Maybe stick the nourishment facts into variables.--Relyk ~ talk < 20:42, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Mass moving

I will, in short order, need to move a large amount of files. I assume that it is best to do this without creating redirects. Therefore, you will have to move them. In what format should I present the list for moving files such that it is easiest for you to move them? Most of them will be moving gallery images from "X armor" to "Y armor" and when alex moved lots of files in this format in the past, he did this to make it easier. Psycho Robot (talk) 01:02, 19 April 2014 (UTC)

By far the best solution for everyone would be to just promote you to the 'patrol' usergroup. But that ain't gonna happen, sez poke. Unless we poke him again? —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 02:33, 19 April 2014 (UTC)
I heard that when you poke poke it makes a black hole. Be careful. Psycho Robot (talk) 02:39, 19 April 2014 (UTC)

Pain & anguish

Hey there, can you help a guy out? Is there any way you could possibly find the icon for this? I've tried everything, rendering it with the api thingy, looked around the skill icons, I just don't know where to look anymore, so I'm trusting your skills are high enough to find this bastard. --Ventriloquist (talk) 21:42, 20 April 2014 (UTC)

Give me a screenshot so I know what I'm looking for. :P —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 02:34, 21 April 2014 (UTC)
Since we only do GMissions on weekends, you might have to wait. BUT this video might be an alternative. I linked the specific part in the video where she uses the skill so if you want, rewind it a bit to get a better look. And hey, at least you get 1080p! I have no idea how to describe the icon, it's sorta like an inverted crab...thing. Good luck.--Ventriloquist (talk) 12:05, 21 April 2014 (UTC)
Found it. You suck. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 12:27, 21 April 2014 (UTC)
Oh, that is such bullshit. No one ever looks at pet skills. Thank you for keeping my sanity. More or less. --Ventriloquist (talk) 14:04, 21 April 2014 (UTC)
It's what I do: steal other users' sanity, cover it in BBQ sauce, chew on it for a while, then spit it out back into their unsuspecting skulls. :D —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 14:52, 21 April 2014 (UTC)
Oh dear god, I'm an idiot. I've been thinking of the wrong skill this entire time. The burrowed bla bla skill is actually just a normal locked icon, whereas the inverted crab icon was from the Return to Surface skill. In my defense...I got nothing. --Ventriloquist (talk) 15:01, 21 April 2014 (UTC)

Is there any way... add The Atlas to the top of the wiki, as it is on the main site/forums? Or is that ANet's domain? --Santax (talk · contribs) 20:14, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

yea we need to re sync with anet's header add the wiki as well just so its uniform with the rest of there pages.-User Zesbeer sig.png Zesbeer 22:49, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
I don't want a link to the atlas on the masthead.--Relyk ~ talk < 22:51, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
why?-User Zesbeer sig.png Zesbeer 22:53, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
only the main site has the atlas, the forums/support pages don't have it. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 22:55, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
And there's no point in adding a link to ourselves because the wiki logo already provides that link. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 23:48, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
The atlas is super boring. I agree with not linking it. poke | talk 23:55, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

I should get some sleep

I actually already clicked this diff, skimmed over the changes, nodded sagely, and closed the tab. I think that's enough wiki for one day. --Santax (talk · contribs) 00:03, 25 April 2014 (UTC)

LOL, you cheesehead. :P —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 00:39, 25 April 2014 (UTC)


Good evening. Do you recall if Special:SMWAdmin resets corrupted subobjects?

Item Prefix

Because I've got 18 of them >.> -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 23:08, 27 April 2014 (UTC)

You think I haven't tried that by now? Big fat NOPE. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 23:15, 27 April 2014 (UTC)
We can only wait for 1.9… poke | talk 23:16, 27 April 2014 (UTC)
And make sure that Justin completely drops ALL of the SMW tables, just to be certain. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 23:17, 27 April 2014 (UTC)
Did they iron out the bug that causes this in the first place? I ask because SMW has moved to a new site for their bug tracking (ref), and I'm not seeing this bug listed. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 08:48, 28 April 2014 (UTC)
1.9 introduced this and that which I am putting my hopes on. poke | talk 11:33, 28 April 2014 (UTC)
This is the patch. It does include new functionality to clear the cache on moves or purges, so that definitely wasn’t there before. poke | talk 11:42, 28 April 2014 (UTC)
that sounds hopeful. :D no more null editing spam. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 11:48, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

Temple events

I don't know anything about the API, so I just wanted to clarify - due to the megaserver consolidation, we can no longer ask "what server is this active on"... but does that also mean it's not possible to merely ask "is this event active or not"?

It would still be helpful to have a table with all the possible temple related events, and an API fetch link to see which are active at the time (if any). Even though this would require some manual clicks on the part of the user, it saves time and money as opposed to waypointing around each of the three Orr maps. Vili 点 User talk:Vili 02:46, 3 May 2014 (UTC)

The events API is completely kaput, just click the link. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 02:55, 3 May 2014 (UTC)
Clearly it's all a nefarious plot by Anet to take money and skill points out of the economy by forcing frustrated players to buy trait guides instead of earn them. Well that sucks. Vili 点 User talk:Vili 02:59, 3 May 2014 (UTC)

The reason I didn't use the template is because it doesn't appear to respect daylight savings time. It's showing UTC-5 for me but I'm actually in UTC-6. Felix Omni Signature.png 15:09, 13 May 2014 (UTC)

The JavaScript should be using your system time to determine the offset. It's showing UTC-5 for me, and that's correct for CDT right now. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 15:14, 13 May 2014 (UTC)
Eh... looks like some wires got crossed last night. It's fine. Felix Omni Signature.png 15:16, 13 May 2014 (UTC)

Zealot's Recipes

I just made pages for all the Zealot's recipes, but I can't figure out how to make the discipline required show up in the recipe item infobox. It has all the same parameters as Recipe: Celestial Draconic Helm, for example, but it shows up there and not in the zealot's recipes. If you've designed these templates to make me look stupid, mission accomplished, jerk. Psycho Robot (talk) 05:54, 14 May 2014 (UTC)

The same lack of professions is also appearing on Explorer's recipes, even after setting the type parameter to recipe sheet (e.g. Recipe: Explorer's Orichalcum Imbued Inscription). 09:30, 14 May 2014 (UTC)
You can unbunch your panties now, it's all good. And if it ain't, then purge the dang page.
Explorer's stuff is all historical, I don't give a frak if they show "correct" info or not. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 12:42, 14 May 2014 (UTC)

Champion Rhendak the Crazed

I saw you alter the quote to Balefire rather than Baelfire, so I guess that's verbatim. That being the case, shouldn't it be a piped link to Gaheron Baelfire with a sic explaining the typo? Or maybe Gaheron's own page is a typo? Or something? Argh, 4.51 am - think I'm going to crash. — snogratUser Snograt signature.png 03:52, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

I didn't edit the content, I only added formatting. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 04:18, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
Baelfire is the proper spelling, so it's likely a typo or mistake on Rhendak's page. Vili 点 User talk:Vili 09:15, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
I thought that was unlike you, Ish. DiffLast must be not quite right. Or me, probably. — snogratUser Snograt signature.png 12:21, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
Oops, taking another look, I think I must have somehow edited the next-to-last revision of the page. I don't know how that happened, but I'll fix it. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 12:25, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Gift of Heroes

Is there a reason why this can't be created yet? I would have thought that a simple recipe-list-by-discipline, plus acquisition from WvW weapons specialist would suffice. Is it because these things don't technically exist yet? — snogratUser Snograt signature.png 00:05, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

The page I deleted said, simply, "Something you recieve, which may be slightly heroic, and gift like." IMO crap like that is just short of vandalism, and retaining it is worse than having redlinks.
I didn't "fix it up" because it's not in the API yet (and won't be until the end of the season, I think?), and I don't WvW, which means I have zero information about it. If you have non-zero information, you have my blessings to create a useful page! —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 00:53, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
Ah, there you go. As I don't have the almighty tools of omniscience like you do, I didn't see the pre-delete page. I was just saying that the rewards are already there, sorta (data mined?), so the magic recipe template would just make a nice list of things that don't exist yet but will, probably. I refrained from doing so because I don't wubwub either, but I thought we could nick the existing work of those who do. I think I might be making sense in there somewhere.
Might do it anyway at work tomorrow (2am again, would be a train wreck now) - because I've never really created a proper page and I really should. Making a page about something of which I have no understanding would have a certain ironic charm. — snogratUser Snograt signature.png 01:23, 21 May 2014 (UTC)


That was odd - we both reverted that in the same instant (presumably), yet my revert sorta never happened. I agree with what you say about boxed armor - the only trace I could find was Mystic Forge#Recipe sheets. I have never seen a satchel of armor on the TP, but it strikes me as a great way of selling sets. — snogratUser Snograt signature.png 20:29, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

The total ingredients are the same whether you craft the bulk satchel/box or the six individual pieces, the only benefit is the convenience of skipping the component stage of crafting. The difference is that the bulk recipe requires an up-front investment for creating the recipe sheet at the Mystic Forge, and I'd guess that most people probably think the (limited) convenience isn't worth the cost.
I say (limited) because it's only convenient if you're going to be crafting that armor set repeatedly, otherwise it's a complete waste.Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 20:35, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
Waste or not, the item(s) and its/their recipe{s} exist in game. Surely they should be documented. --Rhynchelma (talk) 20:54, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
Yes, like we said, they are, but they could do with being a whole lot better. I'm not sure how much research there is in them, but they all require various amounts of mystic coins, crystals, elonian wine and one crafted chest piece of the armor you wish to create. That lot dumped into the mystic forge produces a recipe, which then requires as many components as creating each individual armor piece would have required. Whether you can create recipes for a box/satchel for every craftable armor set in the game, I have no idea. If you're willing to take on the potentially huge task, feel free - the massive amount of work you've already done in your short time here shows you're not afraid of hard work! Er, sorry Ish - you can have your page back now. — snogratUser Snograt signature.png 21:51, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
I have the needed amounts for every armor container recipe (assuming that recipes for the same level and rarity use the same amounts), where should I add them? Furthermore I've listed the food recipes in my user space on the german wiki [5] --Soulblydd (talk) 22:18, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
I would say a new section on each of the 21 pages for craftable armors (24 if ascended armors are "boxable.") So, a new section on Chain armor, Scale armor and so on for the six (or seven) tiers of light, medium and heavy armors. New pages just for boxes would add more unnecessary clutter, in my opinion. — snogratUser Snograt signature.png 22:32, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
Don't put the MF recipe for the recipe sheet on the armor page, the recipe sheet needs its own page, and the acquisition section there will list the MF recipe. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 22:36, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
I seem to have opened the proverbial can of worms here, sorry. As for my "hard work", I'm just trying to tidy up the orphaned pages. Who knows what will follow that? :) --Rhynchelma (talk) 22:44, 21 May 2014 (UTC)


Okay, it's been 3 days since I changed [[:File:Dolyak.jpg]] to a much better, replaced one. In those 3 days, none of the 3 pages it's linked to have changed. I've tried refreshing and refreshing, editing out the info and editing it back in. Now, it wouldn't be so frustrating if it wasn't for File:Accursed Chains.png, which has the same issue. I hope it's just me 'cause otherwise I'm going crazy. I've hit a brick wall and I need help before my sanity slips through the hairy dolyak hooves. --Ventriloquist (talk) 18:37, 22 May 2014 (UTC)

Sometimes the file system gets corrupted. This hasn't happened in a long time because Justin fixed it for us, but apparently that file was already corrupted before the fix. I guess you'll have to re-upload it to a new name. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 18:39, 22 May 2014 (UTC)
What about the Accursed Chains one? Do I contaminate EVERYTHING I touch? --Ventriloquist (talk) 18:41, 22 May 2014 (UTC)
No, precisely the opposite: everything you touch is ALREADY contaminated. :D —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 18:43, 22 May 2014 (UTC)

Replaced content with "smw"

Is this intentional? Santax (talk · contribs) 13:58, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

Guild_Wars_2_Wiki:Semantic_MediaWiki#IssuesDr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 13:59, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
Ah ok, just checking :) I basically know nothing of smw, just wanted to make sure it wasn't a macro gone awry or something. Santax (talk · contribs) 14:02, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
I was being lazy, too - in the past I've given an edit summary of "smw fix before move" or something like that. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 14:05, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

SMW not working for master armorsmith

So I was wanting to update Master craftsman,Armorsmith,Artificer,Chef,Huntsman,Jeweler,Leatherworker,Tailor, and Weaponsmith. I figured I would update {{NPC infobox}} to include the individual crafting services however SMW is not working for Master armorsmith. It is working for Master leatherworker and others however. Any idea on how to fix that? Anzenketh (talk) 20:40, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Probably because the Master armorsmith redirect isn't set up the same as the others. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 20:44, 26 May 2014 (UTC)
The database can be slow to update all the pages. You can force the individual pages to update by making a null edit: hit edit, show preview, then save the page without making any changes. --Relyk ~ talk < 20:51, 26 May 2014 (UTC)
Nope still a issue. I think it is because of the way that we tag Weaponsmith (vendor) and Armorsmith (vendor) I think the best way to fix this is rename all the crafting profession changes to Armorsmith crafting, Weaponsmith crafting,Leatherwork crafting, Artificers crafting, Chief crafting, Huntsman crafting, Jeweler crafting, and Tailor crafting. That will allow terms not to be mixed up. Our other option is to try to force people to use Armorsmith (vendor) and Weaponsmith (vendor) for the respective vendors. Anzenketh (talk) 14:36, 27 May 2014 (UTC)
You didn't follow Relyk's advice - it looks like it's working now. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 14:51, 27 May 2014 (UTC)
I did attempt his advise I likely just updated the wrong page. Looks like the system figured it out now. I will now update the documentation. Anzenketh (talk) 15:23, 27 May 2014 (UTC)