Talk:Pale Tree

Source I thought I'd add the source; people might question it because the name sounds generic.-- Shew talk 21:25, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

Is this the same tree that is currently in Tarnished Coast? If so, any information on how it got moved? Sardaukar 05:19, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Is there any evidence that it's not located in the same place it was in GW1? -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 08:06, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

According to this, the Grove, where the Pale Tree is located, is "Deep in the Maguuma Jungle". There's some distance between the Maguuma Jungle and the Tarnished Coast. The Tarnished Coast is flooded by the rising of Orr. Perhaps the tree was moved to a safer location because of the flooding? Sardaukar 14:20, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Prior to the introduction of the Eye of the North game, the Tarnished Coast was always considered the coast of the Maguuma (i.e., a sub-region). I am sure this is still the case thus the Tarnished Coast is within the Maguuma Jungle. Also, the Tarnished Coast wouldn't be flooded, because it is (mostly) cliffs, there is only one non-cliff edge of the coast, which has enough curves to not flood the area reaching to the tree to a point of it being submerged. Not to mention that basing the size of the tree in GW1, which occurred in less than 6 years, it is 150 years between EN and the rise of Orr thus it would be HUGE by that time I'd bet. -- Konig/talk 04:13, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

See Orr. The Tarnished Coast does get flooded by the rising of Orr. What makes me wonder about the location of the Pale Tree in GW2 as well, is that the Tarnished Coast is Asuran territory. Just makes me wonder how the map will look when we get to GW2. Good point about the size of the tree. That site just said the tree was located "Deep in the Maguuma Jungle" and its current location doesn't fit that description in my opinion. Also, we don't know where The Grove is. We just know the Pale Tree is there. Move the tree and you move the grove. It’ll all make sense when we get there. Thanks for the feedback. Sardaukar 06:26, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

"Long ago, a weary soldier planted a strange seed in the depths of the Maguuma Jungle." A quote taken from here. Oh well, thanks for reading anyway. I'll try to crush my own speculations from now on before I share them. :) Sardaukar 06:44, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

I know of the quote, but the Tarnished Coast is within the Maguuma Jungle, one could say it isn't deep within the Maguuma Jungle, but there are three potential explanations for this (either or both could be the case): Firstly, the scale of the game is not "accurate" (so to speak) so it will seem far closer than it actually is in lore to the coast. Secondly, the tree could of been placed were it was in EN due to us only going to the Tarnished Coast, and not the Maguuma. Thirdly, the coast would be considered deep in the Maguuma due to the distance from the spot to Kryta - though it wouldn't be deep within the Maguuma going from the water. -- Konig/talk 07:32, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

Sorry. My last post was just me realizing my speculation was wrong. I was thinking that maybe the tree was moved to better fit the description of it being "Deep in the Maguuma Jungle". Then I stumbled across the second quote: "Long ago, a weary soldier planted a strange seed in the depths of the Maguuma Jungle." That shot my theory down because from a lore point of view and as you said, the Tarnished Coast is within the Maguuma Jungle. Plus all the other points you just made. Thanks again for the feedback. “When speculation has done its worst, two and two still make four” - Samuel Johnson. :) Sardaukar 15:12, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

Merge ?

Perhaps we should merge this with The Grove due to it being in the same location and making a sub article within the grove article? Just a suggestion. --aut (t) 16:37, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

I'm against a merge because the Pale Tree is extremely significant; it deserves its own article.-- Shew 16:52, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

This definitely seems too important for a merge. Cress Arvein 03:59, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

The Pale Tree is an object, not a location. They are vastly different. What you're asking is like merging the Magdaer with Ascalon City just because Magdaer is in Ascalon City. They are vastly different and both highly important in their own right. -- Konig/talk 06:48, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

Other trees?

There is nothing to even suggest other Pale Trees and Ree Soesbee includes Grand Duchess Faolin of the Nightmare Court as one of the sylvari First Born. http://www.guildwars2guru.com/forum/showpost.php?p=532494&postcount=175 Ramei Arashi 04:43, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Although it is a possibility, you are right when you say nothing indicates it, and that kind of speculation does not belong in main space. Eive 07:42, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

I think they both born from the same tree/mother. However, nightmares exist in the dreams and the nightmare court are those who embrace the nightmare instead. It's like people can get different things/meaning from the same story due to different perspective. Chanw4 07:51, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

well I was going to say something but the article has no references. (Xu Davella 11:10, 29 January 2011 (UTC))

Actually, we KNOW that other seeds exist. The Pale Tree's seed was found in a cavern filled with many other seeds. :) So it's entirely plausible one or more of those other seeds has taken root as well. However, whether they did or not isn't known, so that part should probably be left out. However, the existence of the other seeds should definitely be mentioned (and it is, sooo... yay us!) :) --Amannelle 17:02, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

There are other seed but we do not know what will comes out of the other seed. Chanw4 17:12, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

An image?

Since we don't currently have an image for this, and images can make things look so much nicer aesthetically... could we add this or some adjusted version of it? It is official concept art, after all. :) --Amannelle 17:09, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

fook yes! But I can't because I am wiki nub. :) (Xu Davella 17:12, 29 January 2011 (UTC))

I'm iffy since it's not the actual concept art itself. -- Konig/talk 21:43, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

I'm less fussy. That image looks okay, I think it'll improve the page. -- aspectacle  22:10, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Well, we don't actually use the "actual concept arts" anyway. We mainly use edited versions with edges faded, or just a portion of the image, etc. :) So really, it'd be no different. Just as this is a portion of this, we use (or used, I think after some time we changed the images) smaller images of the professions for their pages. :D Really, I think it should work just fine-- you can fade out the edges if you'd like it to look less like the card. :) --Amannelle 22:16, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Actually, we use concept art files which are given to us. That's not a concept art file but a card which uses concept art on it. :P I suppose it can be added (there should be an image on the wiki already) until a clean one from the artist is given. -- Konig/talk 22:30, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

I put it in. Do you think that should be fine until we have a more suitable image? :) --Amannelle 03:36, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

trivia?

Is it me or does the who Sylvari race and pale tree mirror James Cameron's Avatar? :P - Lucian 20:16, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Just you. Coincidence. --'Mai Yi' talk 20:20, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, the sylvari don't exactly worship this tree with their bodies. And I haven't heard of them praying to it either. - Infinite - talk 20:22, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Ahh ok. - Lucian 20:48, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

I see the similarity, but there isn't enough to put anything on the page. Eive 04:30, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

there's almost no similarity except the fact they're both a special tree.. --The Holy Dragons 16:22, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

What about that the tree could be a reference to Tolkien's Lord of the Rings. (The White Tree of Gondor)

Unless the White trees of gondor are sentient, I doubt they have much in common apart from their hue, the pale tree is probably influenced by the connection between the Aos Sí/Fae and Birch trees.... This page really needs an update to mention that the pale tree is sentient and is female.. :/ (Auberon Dreamwhisper 06:58, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

I don't know much about LotR, but the Female sentient thing is a good point. -- Xu Davella 09:08, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

You might wanna check this out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Trees_of_Valinor KristinaBlueBlur 11:33, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

Laurelin-female golden tree. KristinaBlueBlur 12:15, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

That reference is already a lot stronger, though (and this may be me) the sylvari should find the need to grow a third tree, or we should know of the existance of a second tree to make it fully accurate. But even without, the Pale Tree sounds like a copy of Telperion. What happened to the trees in this reference sounds impossible to incorporate into the game. I am reluctant to add this trivia as much as the other options. - Infinite - talk 13:23, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

If anything the Pale Tree and the Sylvari almost seem like the good version to Halo's Gravemind and the Flood...Hive minds and all that jazz :P ~~A Halo Nerd.

Hive-minds have been around since before Halo. Also, I hate Avatar. You all should too...-- Shew 03:26, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

There are too many trees in mythology to suggest that this is based on Avatar. Especially when we knew about the Pale tree giving birth to the Sylvari long before the Avatar movie came out...--Yozuk 04:12, 27 August 2011 (UTC)

Veldrunner beliefs

So I was reading about how the Veldrunner centaur pride believes in ancestor trees that pass wisdom from one generation to the next. Now...Ventari wasn't a Veldrunner, right? But it's still interesting to see the similarities between this centaur belief and the concept of the Pale Tree. Anyone think there's a connection?-- Shew 14:27, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Hmm, interesting. Source for that piece of lore? Thering 16:05, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

here-- Shew 16:12, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

So it is a possible reason why Ventari stayed by the tree untill he died. Shame its complete speculation :( Thering 16:35, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Oh yeah...forgot...no speculation on main space talk pages. :p-- Shew 16:47, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Noo, I meant that we can't put it into the mainspace article, not the talk page Thering 16:53, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

The pale tree revealed?

Todays release of the Sylvari video[1]seems to have the first image of the Pale Tree as well. I could be wrong, but at the very end of the video, the camera pans out to show an enourmous, and "pale" colored tree.--Will Greyhawk 18:28, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

The pale tree was never "unrevealed" truth be told. I do believe we see portions of it in the very first GW2 trailer. In fact, throughout the entire video you see portions of a gigantic white tree. Konig/talk 20:22, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

You can see the entire tree in GW1. - Giant Nuker 20:57, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

that was just a sprout compared to the fully grown mother tree - i think we should at least add a picture of the gw2 version

ok who's up for jumping from the top? XD Getefix

Pale Tree vs. Avatar of the Tree

I'm just curious how others think we should document the Pale Tree itself, which encompasses much of the Grove, and the NPC the Avatar of the Tree (missing a page atm) which is seen in an instance (forgot name, something chamber I think) and certain personal story steps. Should they be on the same page, essentially being the same figure, or should they get separate pages since one is an interactable NPC and the other is more of scenery (anti-respectively)? Konig/talk 03:38, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

separate page so you can list dialogue. Besides, it's the same as a Champion of <God> in gw1.--Relyk 04:32, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

I was gonna say pages like Lyssa's Muse on GW1w keep things tidy and clear. Manifold 04:54, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

Thing is, the Avatar of the Tree is merely the representation of the Pale Tree - it's the same individual. However, the GW1 avatars are not, sans the gw1:Vision of Glint, but we've merged certain multiple-named/modeled individuals on GWW before too anyways (Gwen for starters). Konig/talk 05:29, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

The Pale Tree as a Dragon

I've heard various (unfounded and non-developer supported) rumours that the Pale Tree is some kind of dragon, and that the Sylvari as they exist are Dragon Minions, similar to the Risen or the Icebrood. There are points to support and debunk this (The Sylvari are, as far as we know, non-destructive, and no other minions have in-fighting akin to the Nightmare Court). However, in other ways it seems to make a lot of sense. Further discussion would be interesting, though it's unlikely we'll have anything in the way of hard evidence until expansions and similar. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.103.181.169 (talk • contribs).

Try using the official forums instead. Wiki discussions pages are meant for discussing contents of the article rather than speculation. Mediggo (talk) 03:03, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Involvement with story

Can someone upgrade this article to include her relation with story, as well as update her current state? I lack English skills for a smooth enough writing, and since she is a very important character in GW2's lore (and repeatedly referenced during various Living World releases), I invite editors to give a help in this matter! – Valento ^msg 17:13, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

All the involvement of the Pale Tree as a character are documented in Avatar of the Tree. And as far as I see, all the story missions are already listed there. Balwin (talk) 09:58, 14 November 2014 (UTC)