Guild Chat - Episode 61

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Guild Chat - Episode 61

Narrative and Voiceover
Rubi Bayer
Eve Eschenbacher
Tom Abernathy
May 4, 2018
Official video

The following is an unofficial, player-written transcript of the episode. The accuracy of this transcription has not been verified by ArenaNet.

The episode of Guild Chat aired on May 4, 2018. Host Rubi Bayer interviews members from the Guild Wars 2 Narrative Team to learn about how they bring stories to life.

hi guys and surprise so back before
episode 3 when the trailer for living
world episode 3 came out we included a
short version of a redo of fear not this
night by MacLaine you guys really loved
it so MacLaine got to work fleshing that
out and it is ready now you guys just
got here for the very very first time
and by the end of this episode it will
be available for all of you on our
soundcloud so keep an eye out for that
but for now we have a couple things I'm
going to talk to a couple of our devs
first though we have one little thing
here if you guys remember the blue
quaggan mug from the holidays for fans
by fans made a little pink version
here's your blue versions friend and
that is coming to their website soon
this thing is enormous I'm so happy
about that but yeah we have we have the
little pink quaggan girl now with her
little hair bow I don't think I have
that just don't think about it too hard
it's fine and it's glue I can still
drink out of it so I'm happy so alright
so that was our that's our new for fans
by friends mug that I kind of dig and
today we're going to be talking about
the narrative process getting the story
from our heads into the live game for
you guys and I'll let our two dev guests
introduce themselves talk about let us
know who you are and what you do here I
am Yvette Barker I am the voiceover lead
I'm Tom Abernathy and I'm unsure which
camera look at that studio narrative
director this is you guys this is me
that once all three of us okay we're
doing it live a quick note if you guys
have questions just drop them in to chat
and we're gonna try to answer a few of
those at the end today so alright well
let's get started let's kind of talk
about how the process goes from
beginning to end where do you start when
all of this begins to get it into the
okay so yeah because because obviously
or maybe it's not obvious but but we
have to write things we have to make a
story before we can record a story so
what's interesting about our process
here is is that because we put out
content every two and a half or three
months you know it's it's an there's an
assembly-line aspect to what we do
that's not necessarily true in all kinds
of games and so we're constantly able to
refine our process and make adjustments
each new episode and so that's awesome
and and we're constantly trying to do
that I'm so the process that I'll
describe is mostly what we're doing now
to some small degree it's what we are
intending to do as we continue to refine
but basically the way that it happens is
we start breaking a season of content
breaking means sitting down and talking
about what we think the season should be
about and that group involves various
people but as you know usually the
constants right now or me and Jessica
price who's story editor for Guild Wars
2 and Lindsey Murdock who is the content
lead designer and Jason Vandenberg whose
design director and and and Mike Z's in
there and various other folks maybe as
well and and when we start talking about
story we actually really like like we're
breaking stuff right now where we're
talking about themes we begin with
themes what do we want it to be about in
a sense of meaning right because because
narrative and games I think the role of
it is we're that we're the discipline
that answers the why questions where the
the discipline that imbues the
experience with meaning the example that
I like to give is that you know if
someone gives you a white box you know
on a screen and a sphere which you can
sort of throw against things or the
floor whatever and stuff that could be
fun for a while but if I say to you okay
now you're you know LeBron James and
it's Game seven of the NBA Finals and
there's two thirds of a second left and
you're at the free-throw line and the
Cavs are down by
I am suddenly so stressed down right
right there's some you know a thousand
people or whatever screaming their heads
off and waving sure I mean you know
obviously suddenly that context changes
everything about that experience right
and that's our job is to provide that
kind of meaning so we start out talking
about that stuff you know each season at
this point has its own set of themes
we're dealing with each season has its
own set of character arcs that's the
next thing that we bring in is is what's
going on with the characters we believe
strongly that all story comes from
character and so so what's going on with
them how are they evolving one of our
big focuses this year has been to make
characters to have characters evolve
over time to have things that happen to
them and the emotional effects of that
stuff be persistent and we talked last
time we were here about bit about timey
for episode 1 and yeah um how we're
doing that with her and she's certainly
not the only character that's true of so
you know we'll we'll sort of get all
that stuff down and and once we
understand what the needs are we're
trying to fill then we'll start to say
okay so what needs to happen plot wise
for these things and there are lots of
questions that come in there are there
certain areas of the world that we want
to go to for the first time or do we
want to go back to where do we think
we're going in a longer term sense and
we will come out of that process with
with a reasonably strong sort of high
level bullet point outline of what's
going to happen high view thirty-five
thousand foot view of the season and
then we bring more designers into the
room obviously Lindsay's been there and
Jason the whole time but we bring more
designers in and we start saying okay
you know talk to us about what your
ideas of gameplay you'd like to do or
and how we can make those things work
together right because you know we can't
talk about I you know if I'm a gameplay
designer and you've turned to me and say
okay you know this season
um arenas you know she's kind of a
teenage dragon now and she's going
through teenage stuff right and you know
you know and I'll be like okay how do I
make game play out of
like like you know that's that's a
challenge for sure so it's a it's a sort
of ongoing collaboration in that way and
designers will come up with all sorts of
awesome stuff till they basically have
their pitch presentation for what they
think the the gameplay of all that
should be and they Jason now and Lindsey
are having them make these amazing
presentations power points where they
chart the intensity both of gameplay and
of narrative across each chapter and all
this kind of stuff and it's really cool
and that's a fairly new addition to the
process really yeah Jason has brought
that in and I'm gonna want to talk about
that at some point in a future episode
okay cool that's amazing right and then
so so so now everybody sort of has a
large sense of what we're doing you know
broad strokes and then we have 3 episode
content teams of course and various
writers assigned to work with them on
various aspects of each episode and then
people start breaking it down I mean you
go from the macrocosm level to the
microcosmic alright and they start
breaking it down in terms of okay what's
the actual outline of the chapters in
the thing what's that outline within the
chapters what's gonna happen plot wise
gameplay wise character wise all of that
stuff and when you've got a pretty good
outline of all that the designer can can
begin to do their work in earnest and
the writer can begin to do their work in
earnest and they sit near each other and
they you know will sit together and like
play through with designers building and
or read through what the writers is
doing and that's all you know it's it's
at its best that's a really like
intimate collaboration that really knits
the gameplay and the narrative together
and it's important to do that because if
they're not working together if they're
in any way not synched up much less at
loggerheads with each other then you're
not going to get a very fun experience
so that's when you start iterating and
figuring out what's going to work and
what's not gonna work very beginning it
already seems such a huge process well
yeah it's months out and for people who
maybe have some knowledge of how that
the TV production process works which is
analogous to what we do but because we
have to build everything that you see
right in in a virtual world every visual
asset has to be created from scratch so
so a TV show can actually get made in a
much shorter amount of time they'll
start breaking story for a season of a
television show if it's a normal one
that starts in the fall they'll start
like they take their hiatus before April
and then and then around late spring
they'll get back together and the
writers will spend about three weeks
doing their version of what I just
talked about bringing the story and then
they'll start they'll go away and
they'll all start writing episodes and
and those episodes the outlines for them
and sort of the locations will get
handed out to groups of of crafts people
who make sets or design costumes or that
kind of thing but it's it doesn't take
them as long it takes them a while but
it doesn't take them as long for us the
process of going from the beginning of
dealing with a single episode in earnest
to that episode being released is
it's it's six months at least I would
say and each of our episode teams that
three of them generally we have done six
episodes season so they're each
responsible for two historically I'm not
making any promises and it is it's just
a long long process and from the
narrative point of view then what we'll
do is as the writer iterates in response
to the collaboration with designer in
response to feedback that they're
getting from Lindsey and from Jason
we will pretty quickly sit at a table
and with with a bunch of narrative team
folks and whoever wants to participate
and will read those things out loud
because this is not fiction writing this
is not writing for the written word it's
writing for people speaking out loud
it's dramatic writing for it's meant to
be spoken right so we want to get it up
on its feet so to speak as quickly as
possible so that we can hear how it
and we actually end up doing that
several times through the process the
first few times we're doing it primarily
for writing purposes and but once once
the design designers are basically
pencils down and and mostly they've done
the iteration they're gonna do and we
sort of settle that script at that point
it goes off to editing and they go
through it and then we begin the vo
process that's where I grab tell me tell
me about table reads like and casting to
talk about yeah yes
so casting roughly two to three weeks
before the episode is is supposed to be
passed off to editing I sit down with
the writers and the designers and say
okay what have you created you know what
you've done
yes yes sometimes that so we I get a
list of all of the all of the named
actor or all of the name characters we
need to bring back in you know we've got
the PCs on there and then how many
generics they need and sometimes I have
to you know - their dreams I said you
know I was I'm sorry we can't have
20 different you know human character 20
different human voices I can give you
you know 10 12 because the SAG contract
says that each actor can do three voices
right if we want them to do more than
that we have to pay them extra but the
problem is for example if you are in a
place let's say where there are lots of
humans like Ilona lately right
you are at you're potentially asking an
actor to come in and give you three
different human voices which some actors
can do and you'll never know it's the
same one but not that many of them can
that's a tough order and it's easier
when some are when they're coming in
they have one human voice one char voice
want to serve voice different kinds of
processing that'll go on and change it
it'll be easier to sort of not let the
player know that that's the same actor
doing all three you can put them in
different places on the map sometimes
for episode three we had 27 different
actors come in you know the ten player
characters plus seventeen more people so
it's it's like throwing a giant party
every couple well the ten player
characters especially that's really
unusual and it's an enormous amount of
overhead I love that we do it because I
think the value of the players is huge
but I'm not gonna lie it's a big it's a
choice to make
yeah so you put it all up on the board
we ascend voice roles out get everybody
listed you know off to back to the the
writers and sometimes I've had to say
like I'm sorry I can't give you you know
I can't give you this but I can give you
just two hundred in fear yeah right
human male voices or I mean I want six
generic in this place and evil say I'm
sorry I can only give you two yeah so
figure out how you can do what you want
to do with you and so sometimes some
adjustment needs to be made or you know
we'll figure out how to to make that
work compromise and and creativity
thrives under hunter restrictions I feel
so the budget to the budgeting process
for this stuff is tough that you've been
doing it for several years now she has a
tremendous hold on it she has a great
knack for economically giving us what we
need and and finding ways even to save
money at times
which is awesome but you know it costs
money to hire actors and a studio and
and we have a company that sort of runs
the process for us called line light and
and we get our directors to them we we
hire so young engineers through them and
all of those supposed we'd then we go
down yeah right some of us have to be in
the room so we've jumped a couple of
steps here okay sorry and huge thank you
to Blaine like by the way yes I wanted
to get that in so let's back up yep two
stars that we table reads so yep once
once we've hit editing paths or was
we've hit the handoff to editing editing
does a proofreading pass and then we get
into table reads where the the narrative
team loke designers audio team we all
sit in a room and read it out loud we
make sure that the script is exactly as
we want it that it's easy to say that
it's not you know people tripping over
over difficult difficult words you know
because if we're tripping over the words
in in the table reads maybe the actors
will trip over it right in the studio so
we think about you know can we can we
rewrite this line slightly because it's
difficult to say
you mentioned localization being a part
of the process that was kind of recent
so I wanted to touch on that we started
bringing localization into the table
so that they could get the context of
everything that's going on in the
episode and and you know how how things
fit together so they could start
thinking about how they would translate
things we were getting comments from
them that you know it's it's nice to
coming from below background myself it's
nice to hear them say like you know you
you called out for example s'mores and
in a line we don't have s'mores in Spain
so I'm sorry that's distracting so so
you have to think about the line
speaking on a low-key I'd here you have
to think about a shin by the way sorry
localization translate into other
languages and so you you wouldn't
specifically just say s'mores and hope
that your your players can figure it out
you might think of you know well what's
a dessert that's kind of like it that I
can substitute here that still makes the
line make sense
Wow no idea and I'm thinking back like
doing blog posts on our side and we're
talking about that a lot of times
there'll be a pun or something and
that's a question does this pun
translate absolutely we want them to
adapt rather than translate directly
right we want it to like like our goal
is not that it be a literal translation
into the languages that we that we do
localize into but rather that it's it's
a similar kind of experience right so as
you said I mean sometimes that means
finding an analogue for something rather
than just the exact same what the word
means all right we have proceeded to
bring it's just those little things that
you wouldn't think of yeah it's it's so
ingrained in your culture that you don't
think about the perspective from the
other culture until they start bringing
things up up to you but yeah we've
gotten localization into the table reads
they can see the context they can ask us
questions we've we've we've we've worked
on that process and where we're working
to make it even better after the table
reads we get our changes in we pass our
scripts on a blind light blind light we
have books all of our actors in our
studio time they're there our vendor and
then you know there's the the time in
Burbank so we fly down and we sit in the
studio with the actors and the directors
the sound engineers giving them the
context giving them the background
explaining the scene what's going on you
know sometimes occasionally rewriting
things on the fly which and very
occasionally you're writing things on
upon request from up here we try to have
one vo specialist which is right now
either Eve or Marissa and one writing
sort of representative which most of the
time is me if we're running two studios
then it could be Jessica price or it
could be Armen Constantine or or it
could be the if it's not one of them
already with a writer who played the
most prominent role on the episode we
usually have about four or five writers
all told getting their hands on on any
given episode so one person originates
the early drafts of stuff whether it's
whether it's open world whether it's non
vo text and also raids and fractals and
stuff like that
events like like one that's coming but
so so by the time it gets to the studio
it's had hopefully the best
contributions of everyone who was around
contributing to making it better and and
n plus I've seen it and and we worked
there when I started here there would be
things that would not get past me now I
get not get in front of me until we got
into the studio which is very
frustrating because that's not the time
you want to introduce any kind of
randomness or or disorder in the process
we're getting pretty good at this point
at buttoning most of that up just so
that I can make it sure make sure that
that everything is is to the quality bar
that we're sort of aiming for right well
and I wish we had we can't show call
sheets right now because they're super
super spoilery true but how specific the
call sheets are and like you were saying
how button-down that process is we go in
there and it's this actor here is the
three people that she's doing and here
are exactly their thirty three lines
eighty seven lines nine lines and I can
see how throwing something in at the
last second by the way can we just add
six more lines onto that rubbery right
it's a time crunch exactly I mean
because because so so the easiest thing
to do is is is when we rewrite in the
studio on the fly so even though we've
heard it out loud numerous times
maybe the actor is still stumbling on it
and it's hard to say maybe we just hear
it in their voice and we realize it
doesn't work as well worded the way it
is as we thought it should maybe we not
very often but but occasionally we may
catch that there's a logic problem or or
or something that's implied by the line
that we hadn't thought of and we have to
change it so that we don't violate
something that else that's happened or
something like that those changes I mean
it's not super easy but particularly if
I have another writer in the room and I
can basically have them like do the
grunt work on on on doing the rewrite
and then showing it to me we can get
that done and it's easy to sort of
capture what's harder
is if we have as we do after the
designers been pencil down after we've
had our vo deadline and we've done our
table reads if stuff comes in very late
and people are go we have to change the
thing now they're always changing it for
good reasons they're changing it because
they've gotten feedback that it can be
better or because they themselves have
realized they can be better right
they're not really supposed to be
changing it at that point but we want to
be flexible we want to make the thing as
good as it can be and so you know three
days before we go down two days before
we go down they'll send us an email and
say oh can we please do this read this
change but this thing it would be like
okay we'll do our best
the problem is once we're in the studio
we're going 90 miles an hour and and
everything is is already organized so
that all we have to do is do the next
thing at every moment right okay so we
can forget those things we can we can
forget those kinds of late kind of
impromptu changes which makes us feel
terrible and then we have to figure out
how to cover for it later but it's a
it's a very intensive as you found out
you know I mean you're sitting there for
for eight or nine hours a day it's 9:00
to 6:00
oh maybe yeah focusing so hard on
everything you're hearing and
everybody's got a different job and one
of the things that I love about the
folks that we work with right now we
tend to work with the same people so
Mark DeRosa is our main engineer sorry
yellow Fuente different del Fuente sorry
Phil Bock and Chris var main directors
they're awesome
Kimber Rose Williams is one of our main
script coordinators from blind light and
we also have Tommy and and client and
other people and what's great is we've
done it together enough times now that
we all know our role perfectly so that
if someone has a question and asks it or
or makes a statement they don't have to
say who it's meant for cuz the person
who it's meant for knows that it's for
their role and responds in whatever way
is appropriate and so there's a minimum
of chaos in that way which is kind of
amazing to watch it's almost poetic I
think it is I'm having that rapport
built up over a period of years is
exactly amazing because I was sitting
here while you were talking I was like
counting you've got one two three four
five six seven like eight people in that
in the bigger studio and they're
focusing so hard on every single line to
make sure make sure the inflection
everything is perfect and it is it is
balletic is a really good and i'll watch
a little bit of that here in a little
bit we've got some video from that that
we can share a very little bit because
again it was so incredibly spoiled all
right so we're down there and do you
guys want to talk a little bit about
giving direction to the actors and how
that works and I mean I know a lot of
that is like Phil and Chris but yeah you
guys have a huge hand in that so you
know I have I'm a recovering child actor
and many many years ago I started at the
age of eleven as a professional actor on
stage and later will stalk you and
although I mostly was done with that by
the time I was through with college but
it does I became a director I became a
theater director 9:01 following a
filmmaker and screenwriter but but it
does give me insight into the acting
process which is very helpful one of the
things that I know as both an actor and
director is that actors there there are
many different kinds of acting training
and technique out there every actor has
their own sort of vocabulary that that
they need you to be able to learn to to
speak to them in to be able to give them
direction in a way that will be
meaningful for them and so part of your
job as a director is is to learn what
that vocabulary is for everybody and use
it and I've had been like my favorite
example elective is is one woman who was
auditioning for a film that I made told
me in the audition that she was taking
painting lessons and she asked if if
maybe I could give her direction in sort
of visual art terms and I was like I'm
not sure what that really means but I'll
give a shot and so I was like she'd do a
line and I'd say can you give me a
little more scarlet in that and she
would make an adjustment and it really
was what I was wanted always incredible
is incredible now that's an extreme
example obviously right I'm so glad you
told that's that's a more beautiful yes
I've directed the studio but I'm
thinking back I'm remembering last week
there was an actor and I'm I'm like
scared to even say who it was but there
was something generically bad going to
happen to this actor and we talked later
and she came out of the studio looking a
little stunned and she was like they
asked me if I was interested in method
acting sorry they didn't do that to you
right I can tell you more about that
later well have different approaches -
right like like Phil's a bit method II
and and Chris much like me when I
actually direct is a little less that
ways a little more outside in is that as
the Brits would say and but it is
important to in a general sense you want
notes always whether they're notes
coming to a writer during the
development process or whether they're
notes to an actor in the studio you want
those notes to be coming from one place
because it can be confusing if they're
not because of the fact that that many
of our actors have been working with us
for so long and know all of us so well
we fudged that a bit sometimes sometimes
Phil and Chris will go ahead and let
them hear directly from me or for me or
for Marissa or whoever else because it
just saves time and they have confidence
that we're not gonna say something that
is gonna randomize the actor entire you
know so we try to keep as orderly as we
can just remembering like one of Phil's
favorite directions is okay you're
talking to the villain so be defiant and
then they'll give the line and he goes
bigger middle finger that's good you
were talking about you directly
sometimes giving the actor direction I
want you to tell the story about how you
had to do that last week okay cuz it is
an awesome story yes well I got like I
was confused because she wasn't actually
even in the room yeah she was sending me
emails I was I right yeah
the bathroom how far back do we start
this so we have well we could say we
have yep the character of course is
played by who's a fantastic actor when
we when we originally cast him for
goreck I wanted to make sure as we were
getting more named characters I wanted
to make sure we got more actors of color
because in into our name characters not
just play engineers and so II Ches name
came up and I I thought he he could do
an awesome Asura I've worked with him a
few times he was here surprised I'm sure
by Israel I was stunned when he started
normally talking I'm sorry because he's
amazing so I was like I think he can
nail this voice we got him into the
studio and he nailed this a service
roaring for episode two and then as Tom
and I were talking between episode 2 and
episode 3 development Tom said you know
I want I want gorrik to be on the
spectrum you said you told me yeah that
you had already that you had seen him as
being on the spectrum okay I didn't
remember that that was me who originated
that idea but that's cool that
particular conversation you told because
there was there was I mean the thing was
there wasn't that much court dialogue in
- right my only show up at he and Blish
at the end and so he had talked about a
bit but there wasn't that much and but
but in 3 not to get you know too much
into it but there's there's more gorrik
in 3 and I know yep yeah and and and so
so the character evolves right I mean we
learn more i what it should say is we
learn more about the character as we're
writing more of them and and I think it
did become originally you know time Ian
episode 2 headlines about court there so
like he's he's really kind of weird and
annoying and like all this kind of stuff
and and I didn't like my note to the
writer about that stuff was was let's
not do that let's not tell the player
what to think about this person let's
write the character
and so we backed off some of that a bit
but but I guess it must have occurred to
me at some point that actually the
things that that that people were
perceiving as odd about him actually
could be reframed as him not being a
jerk but rather him not being fully
aware at all times of social cues of how
he's coming off and and yeah I mean that
that started to sound like like someone
who's on the spectrum to me I am NOT an
expert in that though and Eve is because
she's on the spectrum and so so that's
why he was like super resource for this
yeah we're sitting having this
conversation and I was so excited I'm
like yes I want this to happen because
you know more representation is great
and and being on the spectrum myself I
could be like let's let's do this and
and I want to you know have good
representation for this so we talked
about it a little bit you know getting
in during the development for episode
three and when we got down to Burbank
for episode three I said you let do we
want to lean into this on the on the
performance do we absolutely want to
make sure that this comes through the
performance and Tom said yes let's do it
you know we're committed to this which
made me very happy
so when Gore X actor came in ek came in
I was supposed to be in the other studio
you know working with Matt Mercer that
day and I you know politely told Matt
I'm sorry I have something I need to do
for a few minutes you know this is
something I need to do and I can't just
hand it off to somebody else but we're
gonna start a few minutes late he was
given he's the sweetest dude on the
planet so sweet and a real pro he could
get through oh yeah but I was like we're
gonna start a few minutes late just so
you know I have to run over the other
room for a minute and I you know found
ek and said okay this is what we're
doing with your character cork is on the
spectrum and since I am on the spectrum
I want to give you a few notes about how
how that performance would come through
how he would how he would sound a little
bit different you know without being
like you must read the line like this
because he's a professional he knows how
to do it but I just wanted to give him
that little background very foreboding
by the way to get Lecter
actors actual line readings unless they
tell you to do that yes so so I I said
you know being on the spectrum it's you
know we're not emotional as robots where
we're not you know just like going to be
angry or or flat all the time
it's more that we don't pick up on
social cues we don't realize that there
is hidden meaning to what we say or
subtext to what we say or what other
people are saying so it may take you a
moment you know if you brain cycles to
get to that before you go oh yeah okay I
get it now
and you're you're going to be focused on
things because it's something that
you're excited about but not in that can
kind of make you oblivious to what's
going on around you if you get really
excited about something or you know if
you're upset about something it's gonna
come through but you may not realize
that the words you are saying can be can
be read a different way by somebody else
in the room until they react and then
you go oh you know whoops yeah so I gave
him that note and I said you know I
really appreciate you doing this and now
I have to run and just do that his lap
and ran off but he is he is amazing he
nailed it
you know III I think it probably helped
in a little in a way that I wasn't there
for all of its okay maybe but but so
like I said I mean what she was doing
though and it was helpful because she
was he was working with Matt on a PC yep
we were working with UK on on Gork and
and we were moving through the script at
roughly the same pace so Eve would send
emails because she would see a line
coming up and say tell him this this and
this as sort of the subtext for it and
she would be almost really reliably by
about 2 or 3 minutes ahead of us hello
so that I could be prepared to actually
and I would read him the email and you
know thing to understand about both
dramatic writing and acting from a craft
perspective both of them
are really all about subtext and in
games this is the thing that gets
forgotten all the time but you know most
time in games you don't even like
subtext is not saying people even are
thinking about but for us it is for us
we really it's important for us to focus
on it because it's again it's the thing
that gives words actual meaning right so
you can have a line as an actor that was
written for you which you can interpret
any number of ways and say any number of
ways sometimes you can say it in a way
that makes clear that the meaning that
you're you know transmitting is
virtually 180 degrees opposite of what
the text actually seems to say right so
ek isn't amazingly skilled and an agile
actor and I would read him these emails
that Eve was sitting what was sending
and and whereas his his first read if
we'd already done a take of the line
might have been like say the line could
be read in a way which makes it seem
like you know one interpretation is
gorrik is is being callous right and and
and focusing on the thing that he cares
about the science thing whatever it is
rather than the thing that's dramatic
that's happening in the route that
everybody else in the room is thinking
about right so you could play it as just
he's a callous kind of creep an occasion
occasionally that might be some of that
might be the first take that would come
out of BK and then I would read him the
emails that he would send and he would
go he would think about for a second to
go okay and and you could seed them
minut calibrations going on in his head
and and suddenly he would do the line
again in a way that made it clear that
gorrik simply wasn't aware that he that
he couldn't
perceive what everybody else was
perceiving and and that if they call him
on it which at times they may he's
genuinely confused and and and sorry
contrite he doesn't mean to be offensive
right he's not callous no no he's a
sweet guy actually right who gets
misunderstood because of the spectrum
stuff and ek would make the most amazing
adjustments to dial that in very
specifically and I told Eve we were you
know each of each time he'd do it I'd
write her back and I'd say oh I think
you're really gonna like what he did
here and and when she listened to it she
was like oh yeah he nailed it completely
I'm so excited
there's an interview with ek that we
will air later and I had told not later
today I'm sorry I know I need to find it
for you I'm still sorting through files
because there are literally six or seven
hundred files I'm working on it yeah I
was telling Eve that when I talked to ek
later I was one of the things that I was
asking him was tell me about that
challenge and portraying a character on
the spectrum and he said I had so much
help and he said it was it was you and
you conveying it that made this work for
him so it was that and that's an extreme
example excuse me there goes my voice
that's an extreme example but giving
that direction like you said helps them
dial it in very very specifically
without giving line reads I hadn't
considered giving line reads but it's
good to know that it's what a bad thing
to do yeah that's that's what a director
who doesn't know what they're doing they
will do and the actor will generally
find it offensive just in the same way
that a director will find it offensive
if a screen writer writes shot
overtly explicitly into into a
screenplay yeah because you're stepping
on somebody else's professional toes
they have a job to do there's an area
that is theirs you need to give them
room to do their job it's like if I if I
looked at you for Ruby and I said well
you need to write this forum post like
this what do I know right manager why
don't ya
I give you I give you the slight notes
about what I need out of you and then
you step back to lay I don't collect you
don't your magic the editing telling you
exactly that is an interesting point
it's something I've not had a reason to
think about before but when you yeah
well and I mean to be frank we're
sensitive to it because I don't think it
will come as a surprise to anybody that
a lot of times what we do looks
deceptively easy to people you know they
figure I watch stories on in movies and
then read and play games and I I write
emails and stuff and how hard can
writing be you're just making stuff up
right you said just and that's exactly
it that's all right yeah why don't you
just yeah yeah and it's you know let's
let's just say that's not the case we we
may not will like work in a different
you know language like code or whatever
but but there are a huge number of
skills that are required for one to be
proficient in to do what we do well so
well I'm just going through the process
here I think gives a good example I mean
and we're not even done this is just
getting it recorded I feel like I'm in
the game
alright so we get all of that we bring
it back here apparently in a handbag or
something and suddenly handbags and just
if it is anything that you carry in and
I was just baffled like there's so much
jargon I don't know it's yeah we get we
get hand backs of polished cut named
files which I then used to import into
our tool and then run processing on so
for a couple of weeks it the the audio
that our devs our designers our QA team
are listening to sound like just the
actors performance the chart don't sound
like Chara they sound like right the
regular actors while I get everything
together and run the processing and get
it reinforcing basically does what the
processing ad pitches you know for for
the chart pitches it down and adds those
those mouth noises
yeah yeah the rougher tones she's not
wrong no no I mean drew drew on the
audio team made made these processes I
just push a button for that for that
part I mean I do a lot of I do a lot of
stuff over there but when it comes to
the processes I push a button and let
Drew's magic run so who doesn't is what
races do do not get processing charm nor
and get processing down yet processing
pitch down and and for the charge
additional textures added the away can
get processing Joko gets processing
ghosts get processing cost
yeah cost gets processing because you
know weekend I had this panic moment
trying to remember if we had introduced
oh yeah he was in episode 1 yeah and but
like Asura Suvari human those are just
the straight actor performances none of
those which surprised me actually I
assume disorders yeah and yeah I didn't
think about joke oh I mean nolan north
is good but yeah when we when he comes
like the process nolan north as Joko
sounds basically like this it's about
this pitch which is amusing right
totally very funny very arched sort of I
like to describe him as a cross between
cue from Star Trek next generation and
King George the third from Hamilton but
but then of course he gets process and
there's a whole dimension down here that
gets added to it so it's much fuller
yeah it's a little scarier it's how we
can have nolan as the player a human
male pc human male talking to Nolan as
Palau Joko without it being really
obvious and it's a versus right yeah or
as mordremoth that's right yeah does
like I said there there are actors that
you know they're they're not a
dime-a-dozen for sure but there are
voiceover actors who are have so much
range that they can do what we call a be
a scene which is play two characters a
scene and you don't know it's the same
actor or even some of them in Nolan is
one of these can ABC is seen um and have
three characters and you don't know it's
all the same it's a it's amazing to
watch them do what they do it's a very
specific set of skills actor wise and
and similarly what I said a few minutes
ago about narrative I think
having voiceover actors and those of us
who work with them sometimes get a bit
put out at the way in which big-name
like like animated movies and stuff will
take big-name stars as voices for things
who maybe don't have any voice over
experience at all and sometimes it works
out fine but sometimes it doesn't
because the skills needed to give an
effective performance on camera are not
the same skills as those needed to give
an effective performance that is all in
your voice in other words you can't rely
on face body language anything any kind
of physicality it's got to all be put
into this right and and that is not easy
it's a it's a very elite set of skills
that these people have
well that's it's hard on their voices to
I mean you're taking breaks you're
making sure that yep we will delay like
screams or all that stuff if we have any
to the end so that we don't blow them
out early we fortunately we don't have
as much screaming as as some other some
other games - such a great point right
there we don't have as much screaming or
shouting as other games - so there's
it's not a huge portion of their
performance but we'll still delay it to
the end so that they're not trying to
you know scream and then whisper yeah
because then you can hear it in the
whisper afterwards the other voices has
taken some strain yeah all right so we
get all the processing done and then you
just stick it in game and it's over so
we skipped over doing taffy over
cinematics which which sometimes even
I'd dropping lines for cinematics we
have to do cinematics an episode ahead
of time so we will record them like
Cinemax for episode 4 we actually
recorded with episode 3 this time but
the Cinemax folks need more lead time
than that because it takes them a long
time to do so so sometimes even I and
Jessica whoever will hop in the booth
and and give them really terrible temp
vo to try to work with but so so at this
point then the vo is in the game it's
implemented but it's just I mean the
best way I can express it is it's kind
of just been tossed in in the general
place where it's supposed to be right
and we don't want it in general place we
want it to be tight we
to have good timing we want things that
are funny to be timed properly so that
they will make you laugh we want things
that are scary to be timed properly so
that they will make you afraid
etc and so at that point the one of the
writers will sit down usually the the
principal Golden Path writer will sit
down and and play through and and listen
to the way the dialogue is firing and
move it sometimes in minut you know bits
of seconds one direction or the other
earlier or later and until it sort of
plays the way that we want it to editing
is both visual editing and and and sound
editing are aspects of an entertainment
experience that people maybe aren't
always aware of what an incredibly huge
impact they have on things but you know
if you have us if you have a sequence
where you have a bunch of lines that are
not where nobody's really taking a hand
to trying to place them properly it can
feel very slack like there's no energy
in the thing conversely once you've when
somebody's gone in and adjusted that
stuff and it feels tight and snappy and
and like there aren't a lot of pauses or
dead time and that kind of thing it just
the energy returns and fills up the
experience and its really cool so
they'll do that and then they'll usually
like collect the the big narrative
moments and they'll they'll sit down
with me and show this to me and I'll
give them any feedback that I may have
on it so that improves the timing of
everything and we're focusing entirely
on English here at the moment oh my gosh
loke is running in parallel with us
can't start on each stage until after
we've done ours
so once I've handed the scripts off to
blind light which is backing up a little
bit in the process I also hand the
scripts off to Luke who passes them off
to their localization partners in in
Europe where they record I believe
French is recorded in Paris German is
recorded in Homburg and I'm not entirely
sure where our Chinese video is recorded
I apologize so anyway you just don't
know more than we do so but they passed
it off to their Studios for translation
we get you know queries back and forth
like what about more
yeah what are s'mores what is what is
this in context - can you give me a
little more information about this you
know if we we use a chart a phrase it's
a little bizarre to them idiomatic
they'll ask us about it and we try and
explain it so that they can get the best
the best translation into their language
that it makes the most sense in their
language and then this is an area that
we're working really hard right now we
talked a little bit before um to improve
because at some point we realized that
half our players play this game in a
language other than English and that we
had virtually no visibility into what
was going on with that right and that's
not to impugn the folks that we have
here work on low because they're
terrific yeah but but we realized that
in talking to bash Kim who's the head of
the Loeb team we realized that that that
the best way to ensure that that the
narrative experience for players and
other languages was you know at the same
standard as what we want it to be for
English since we don't speak those
languages was to actually invite the
local team to assimilate more into us
into our team so that they don't
necessarily have to ask so many
questions about context because they've
been there for table reads they've seen
scripts they know they have a sense
themselves of what some of the answers
to those questions are and it's fairly
early in our attempt to do that but I
think already my sense at least is is
that it's had a wonderful effect I know
the low team loves it and as we've said
they're starting to adopt some parts of
our process and do them themselves for
their part process and they're in their
languages and you know it's just I mean
we need to make sure that we're always
trying to get the best possible
experience for players that we possibly
can and this was an area where we could
make improvements and we are well and
that's that makes me go back to what you
were saying about adding vo lines while
you're already down in Burbank in the
studio it's a ton more efficient if you
get this done earlier in the process and
everything is ironed out and everybody
knows what's going on yeah because if
not then Eva Marissa has to make sure
they catch all of those things and then
give them
can say here are changes here things
yeah way redo all that work yes
which look loves they love it as much as
we love it having an antidote which we
have our English audio hand backs of the
actor performances not the process but
the actor performances I pass those on
for Lok to pass along to their studios
they use them as guide tracks okay so
they can since we don't always have
representation in the studio they can
listen to the English and be like oh
this one's supposed to be angry this
one's in combat you know we can they can
get that extra context right from the
English performance so that they can
have theirs their content or their vo
and that gets imported after the English
you know another processing pass timing
QA all of that fun stuff so those can
only raise the quality that we hope and
we've also told them you know a lot of
animated things get when they get
localized into other parts of the world
they go to great lengths to find a voice
that sounds a lot like the voice in the
original language or whatever and and
one thing we've been clear on is let's
not do that you guys cast the best
actors you know your your your time ii
does not have to sound like Debi
Derryberry I'm not sure anybody in the
world sounds like Gary gift right music
they can use it as a guide but it does
sure would be it exactly exactly you
don't have to be slavishly bound to it
right and find the right actor for the
role in your language and what the the
thing that pops into my mind at this
moment is Kingdom Hearts in Japanese
because my background in localization is
in Japanese to English localization and
listening to Kingdom Hearts Donald Duck
in Japanese sounds like Donald Duck in
English like they do the voice and it's
almost unintelligible because wow he's
got that you know weird young boy voice
I mean he's almost an unintelligible
that's that's Disney's called it's not
mine but it's just an example of like
slavish Lee sticking to a performance
and making sure it's exactly the same in
all languages maybe that isn't the best
way to do it
I need to hear this well um we have a
little bit of footage from our last
video session and then I want to take
some questions you guys are still up for
that please don't change your bikes I
already told them yes I do have one
question that I noticed yesterday that I
didn't have a good answer for we've
covered a little bit but somebody was
asking if we always have recorded our vo
in Burbank in English in English to my
knowledge and there's been a couple
we've been a couple times where actors
couldn't make it in right I guess I
should say we've been centered in
Burbank for all of our recordings but we
have had a few instances where an actor
was elsewhere in the world on set for
something that they needed to remote in
and record we've had actors remote in
from Austin from New York and from
yeah that was that was weird because of
the time change so that was Ron you on
our previous PC charm male he was he was
filming Marco Polo during heart of
thorns recording oh wow and so we had to
get to sessions with him from Hungary
remotely so he was in a studio in
Hungary where we were getting the audio
and then we I was Skyped in there was
because the 9:00 hour time difference at
the time it was here in the US in
Pacific time it was a 9:00 to 9:00 to
1:00 session 9 a.m. to 1 p.m. session
and then a midnight to 4:00 a.m. session
Oh which he had sleep in between but I
had a nap okay well cool that's
interesting I'll tell you what why don't
we take a look at our vo footage and
then we'll let you guys answer some
questions from people watching all right
we'll be right back that's enough of
that that's enough of that
this is like the cops are gonna figure
out what to do with you so this whole
thing is like don't go anywhere like
stay here the cops are coming right I'll
deal with it don't go anywhere
the sunspears will decide what to do
with you now I'm liking where this is
but now just to say that you more to
separate out those sentences I'll deal
with it don't go anywhere
the sunspears will decide what to do
with you Oh more like it by the way that
breath in between 2:00 and 3:00 that
stuff so good okay keep that in there
all right I'll deal with it don't go
the sunspears will decide what to do
with you
here's why yeah someone's like oh no
this is what you say here's you quiet
what if he hears you one more for me you
had it right there the idea of this it's
kind of dual it's like you're saying yes
absolutely not but then also you're
gonna reassuring yourself because that
idea for you and equally to any two-bit
ibly indubitably something here the
indubitably indubitably see this is just
pre-recorded for here access denied
access denied access granted access
granting can we get sorry I swear I had
a note about this and it apparently
didn't make it in I can't we get a alts
for line three where you just kind of
giggle a little like you you personally
program this and maybe you're having a
little bit of fun with it sure take six
access denied even a tighter care gopher
nailed it
access denied that's an alt tell him to
sit tight nice I like that
and so down just a bit in the sense of
you don't know you know he's a bumbling
idiot you don't want to get hurt and
you're kind of like tell him to see
tight me too gross me too I think the
words you're looking for are thank you I
think the words you're looking for are
thank you I love watching them emote as
there is they're doing this yep
no I don't want to say the energy
because I didn't mention her name before
the engineer in that last shot was Bree
she's the other engineer she's terrific
yeah yeah the blame like Kurt is amazing
they are also so good all right so why
don't you guys take some of these
questions and knock these out okay so
someone who's definitely not Cory from
blind light says is there an influence
from real-life situations in guild wars
or is it imaginative fantasy do we have
to choose I mean really you know I think
it's it's actually both for sure so so
here's the thing I think anyway if you
if you want to make John Romo Tyrael
like fantasy or science fiction really
come to life it has to be first and
foremost about real people it has to and
then those people can be robots or they
can or golems or whatever you write that
I mean they you know I'm using people in
a very broad sense but like I said
before story comes from character story
comes from the fact that every character
every because it's true of everyone in
the world has things that they want you
know an acting that's called objectives
and things that they need and there's
generally if you're doing it right
there's a difference between those two
things and the difference between those
two things what you need and what you
want is the thing that creates conflict
within the character and sometimes
conflict without the character and
creates the sort of thing that the story
is about now in that sense that's real
world psychology you know for sure that
is so our character is we very much
think about them in those turn
we're also absolutely influenced by
things that go on in the real world and
I'm talking about you know when we make
video games in general broadly and and
those things will have an impact and I
think there are times when stuff that
we're talking about writers especially
will we'll talk to each other in a
shorthand often of references to actual
things or occasionally to other stories
because we know sort of what that means
so so if we say you know something like
oh it's a Rapunzel situation than you
know the other person will know a meteor
talking about someone who's stuck in a
place that they can't get out of and you
know but by someone who's supposed to
love them or something like that and and
we've definitely we've definitely done
that with with this stuff I mean for
example the the best one I could think
of is the situation in Ilona with Joko
and and his having sort of had his you
know bony foot on the throat of the
entire area for quite some time at this
point you know and as of episode two
we've got sunspears who are now fighting
back against him and are trying to
retake parts of that and deal with the
people who live there who are starving
and and have no water and stuff because
Joko is sort of like kim jong woman and
and you know cuts off resources to his
own people and the sunspears and i
actually used this terminology at times
and talking to both writers and actors
about it very much I think at times are
reminiscent of of you know our allied
military forces in places like
Afghanistan where where they're there to
work with a population that maybe
doesn't trust them entirely or that
certainly at least is is beleaguered and
and you know I think we're all
unfortunately familiar from the last 17
years of what those kinds of
environments look like what the dynamics
of those situations are we
on the news so many times and so it's
very easy to use that as an analogue and
turn into an actor and say this is sort
of what you're doing there and they go
okay great I got it so so it's I mean we
use it we use it for inspiration but we
also use it as a as a shorthand way to
communicate about about the work itself
because everyone has that context yes
yes all right what else do you guys get
all all excited when certain voice
actors show up we get excited for
everybody we do we love our cast they're
amazing yeah our cast is amazing we get
to see them every couple of months and
is fantastic it's it's a joy when they
it's really funny yep and some of them
worry I mean you know we're we will
sometimes some of them will go out with
us and evenings we'll have dinner
together will we'd go do karaoke
together sometimes you know we have a
great relationship with them and and
some of them because because even I've
both been doing this quite some time
some of them we've known for 10-15
Jocelin blue I've known for gosh 20
years I think maybe ish are almost
before I even knew she was so you know
it's yeah that's a great part of our
work life for sure I worked with Yuri
Lowenthal and Steve bloom and Nolan
North on my first voice acting project
back in 2005 at a translation company I
worked at in Tokyo and so when when we
when we came down once for uh for Guild
Wars and I got to run into URI for the
first time in like ten years he's like
oh my gosh thought I'd see you again
Jota thing that's so cool hey-oh so bin
Lubar says wait wind and Nolan appeared
three times in one scene to clarify
didn't say he had I said he appeared
twice he's gonna be er has appeared as
him as himself as the the human male PC
and also as Joko I don't know that he
has appeared three times
we've done but he could is the thing
he's that good
I think if if it's a goal now
yeah the PC was talking to mordremoth
and joko at the same time or yeah that
would be a situation which could happen
rain arctica says did any of the a net
staff do some voice acting for random
NPCs or is everything from actors so
here's the thing since we are which my
camera so we are signatories as are most
of the game companies if not all that
you know about to the contract that
exists between the Screen Actors Guild
and the major game companies and part of
what that contract says is is that no
one who is not a member of sag can do
voices in a video game made by a company
that's signatory to it so the answer to
that is no in the old days in the Wild
West absolutely like I you know on the
first few games that I wrote on destroy
humans the director Carrigan and I would
like we would realize on the last day
that they were you know things that
little things we had missed and we
needed to record and there was nobody
there but us unfortunately we've both
been actors so we just happen to do it
but not allowed to do that anymore we we
do occasionally do scratch audio but it
does not leave this office it does not
make it into life and you wouldn't want
it to it's for dev purposes only just so
that there's something other than robo
voice or or so yo for rough timing or
its own joy but yes
yeah I'm personally I'm not a fan of
Robo voice but but if it works for
people that's cool
tell us ask to do all the choices have
processing female voices sound less I
don't know how to say beastly I believe
they sound cool to be honest the charm
male and female do have separate
processes so they they get slightly
different adjustments to their voice and
and things but the female charge still
does have process yes
the female char has processed the dil
char has processing it's just slightly
different yep interesting result says
when writers introduce new narrative and
game assets what are the type of
discrepancies or challenges the
designers have when collaborating with
artists and programmers how designers
introduce a new idea to be implemented
and have the process developed with
artists and programmers in general
it's a very collaborative process it is
very collaborative that's right I have
to work with a lot of people that's
right I mean you know the writers and
designers will be in contact frequently
with art about assets that they're going
to need for four things they're doing or
new characters or new characters outfits
or stuff like that the process for for
this sort of writer designer interaction
once once we've done the story breaking
that that I talked about earlier
basically is in the designer whereas the
writer starts writing drafts what the
designer does the designer starts
building in a sense in essence a draft
of the the chapter that they're going to
make and that means you know putting
environment together placing props and
characters in that environment you know
may having having characters do certain
kinds of mechanical or movement oriented
things to do what they want to do and in
terms of script most the time what
happens is the designer once we've got
all of that stuff outlined and that's
why it's important to have it outlined
so everybody knows whatever I was doing
the designer will is essentially taking
the first pass frequently at at sort of
dialogue that will go with game play and
they will give the writer or what we
call a stubbed in version of the script
and it could be and frequently is and
probably should be really limited like
it's it's like you know PC where are you
timing I have no idea but you know like
it's not supposed to be good it's just
supposed to be it communicates in a
clear enough way sort of what's in
designers head about house how they see
the stuff that's in the outline kind of
playing out in that moment and the
writer then we'll take that stubbed in
conversation and and iterate on it
oftentimes a bunch and it may it may
bear very little resemblance at the end
of the process to what it started out as
other than sort of getting the most
important bits of information across
that supposed to but again that's a
back-and-forth constantly this is the
most so I've worked in theatre i've
worked in film and TV a little
I've worked in games now for twenty
years and and and video games are
without question the most collaborative
art form
they make film look like a one-man show
which is crazy yeah it's it's really
like like like nothing happens the idea
idea of tourism in in video games is
just ridiculous because nothing happens
without dozens if not occasionally
hundreds of incredibly talented skilled
experienced people bringing everything
they've got to bear on the task that is
they're part of what they're doing and
and therefore the communication between
all of those different parts has to be
frequent and and regular and and open
for it to work I'm gonna grab one here
on the bottom denarii de bet says
question there's been some bits of
voices talking over each other like The
Shining Blade oath how hard would it be
to have the first bit of an interruption
laid over the last bit of what's being
interrupted rather than the interrupts
II pausing as if cut off but the other
line waits a second to commence that's
one of those moments you don't realize
how much your texture goes into that
exact moment because that's a that's the
game engine the programming telling
which file to play when what to do if a
file gets cut off without time a file
overlaid over another file it's it's one
of those things you just think happens
naturally because you do it in speech so
much that you don't realize that there
is a whole like structure behind all of
that in every game you play that
dictates how the game engine handles it
so cuz that goes back to what Thomas say
yeah I'm sorry about it seems
deceptively easy yeah and it can appear
like well why don't you just tell that
why don't you just tell him to say
something a second sooner and and if I I
can do that and think okay I can have my
actors deliver these lines as if you
know this person's being cut off yo so
cut yourself off and in delivering this
line and you know this lines gonna play
overtop of it but then I actually have
to get into the game engine and
tell it to make that adjustment and and
depending on you know which game engine
you're building you know I'm not
specifically talking about goers I'm
talking about all games in general at
this moment the game engine itself and
how it runs those files
it may have code that says stop playing
an audio file or it may have code that
just says no this audio file plays until
this audio file it's done and we don't
know how to handle it any other way and
so like as a player you don't realize
that there's that much going on in the
background and for every second of every
audio file that you hear and we're so
we're trying another area we're trying
to improve is our interaction with audio
this season players have already seen in
episodes 1 & 2 a number of moments that
we're basically a combination of
narrative and design and an audio came
up with ideas for doing things with
audio that would be really cool that we
haven't tried to do before and things
like for example you know we have Joko
speaking through characters and in that
specific instance there was referred to
speaking through like a roomful of
characters right so you hear their
voices and you have to hear djoko's
voice and we have to record all those
people doing that and we have to know
about what we want the timing to be so
generally will record Joko first in that
situation then we get everybody else to
kind of match the timing roughly but not
exactly because we don't want it to be
like you know the stuff with joko and
tie me over the comm in episode 1 in the
middle at the at the prison where you
hear him killing and awakening people
and you hear her you know reacting to
that I mean you know was creating a
whole it was like an audio play right
creating a whole sort of soundscape that
was going on that hopefully if we all
did our jobs right the idea was like it
makes you crazy because you want so
badly to intervene and you can't there's
nothing you can do you don't even know
where she is in the world
right and so I mean you know Audio loves
giving opportunities getting
opportunities to do that kind of stuff
and really show what they're capable of
and so we were trying to keep pushing
each episode and come up with more and
more interesting things for them to do
we're working we bring the audio team in
on the table reads as well and and
discuss with them like this is this is a
moment that we see coming up you know
can you think about how we can do this
how we can you know not just on the
performance side like the the moment
where Joe Cota starts talking through
the inquest asura and I believe it was
episode 1 tears I mean it was absolutely
yep yeah but he keeps doing it I mean he
does in every episode where you know
you're hearing these layered voices like
on our end you know we had we had Nolan
do it first and then we played the audio
back as the other four voices were we're
delivering those lines so that they
could hear it and match the rough timing
but then we had to hand it off to the
sound designer in and the audio team to
add more layers on top of that and
processing on top of that to add you
know to make it that moment because it
wasn't just the performance it wasn't
just dumping the file and the engine and
hoping it was price you know making it
making it work and building and adding
all of this groundwork and and in layers
of work and polish to make it that
moment and again I point out we do this
every two and a half to three months
this kind of work goes into every single
episode that comes out every two and
after three months and yeah there's
nothing easy about it god are you
kidding yeah so well thank you guys very
very much I appreciate you answering all
the questions that you could write right
yeah and we the ones we didn't answer me
lose because we already addressed them
so we looked at them for sure yeah it's
not that we're mean well I will let you
guys get back to work thank you so much
for your time this was really really
fascinating there was a lot that I
didn't know even after talking to you
about it earlier this week so and thank
you guys very much for coming and
hanging out with us
today we all appreciate it if you want
to read a little bit more from the lower
than the narrative process I'd in our
forums the last ArenaNet forum chat was
more on the narrative that's right so
check that out and otherwise we are good
and I will see you guys back here next
week on Gil jet
thanks guys fear not this night

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