User talk:08Ray

Mystery tonics

We will not be listing all the skill tables for the forms from the mystery tonics. We will be linking to the equivalent tonic pages, such as Snow Owl Tonic, and list the transform skills there.--Relyk ~ talk > 21:48, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

As long as they all have an equivalent tonic page that's fine aswell :) EDIT: Wouldn't work with the Endless Halloween Tonic, but (upcoming) special event random tonics won't have that many forms so it's okay to have that on the same page. — 08Ray 21:54, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

The Mystery Tonic was an update the randomly gives one of the tonic forms you could receive for the BLC, so yes there is an equivalent page for all of them. It won't be the same for other random form endless tonics obviosuly--Relyk ~ talk > 22:22, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Yup. Btw for as far as I know as you said Mystery Tonics use all the transformations previously from the BLC. So does that mean we can just copy that list of tonic as possible transformation outcomes for the (beast) tonics? Because I believe some are still missing. Also do you think they actually made some transformations common and some rarely? Or did you previously also had a higher chance of some tonics from the BLC than on some other tonics? I'm thinking of removing the common and rarely distribution. Looks to me like it's purely random if you look at the (furniture) and (forest) versions, nobody reports more common tree or furniture transformations than others. Only that statue but that's most likely because that's the only transformation that really differs from the rest so it's looks like it's rarely compared to a piece of furniture. EDIT: And I just changed the CB skills on the Mystery Tonic pages, this does look better! — 08Ray 22:59, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Costume Brawl skills

Don't name the sections "Costume Brawl skills" because some skills on that may not be Costume Brawl skills. None of the tonic skills were Costume Brawl skills until Anet changed them after Halloween 2012. And omit the skills section if there aren't any skills.--Relyk ~ talk > 04:15, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

The only skill that's not a Costume Brawl-only skill during transformations is Return. All other skills are. So I don't think it's a problem to name it Costume Brawl skills, for clarification. Also my thoughts were by adding to pages that a tonic gives you no CB skills (while almost all do now) it would also be clearer and people won't think that the info about the CB skills is just missing. Think this takes away some confusion. — 08Ray 04:23, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

EDIT: How about placing it under Notes that a tonic has no CB skills? We also put other missing stuff under Notes that normally is present like being able to jump. The info should at least be somewhere on the page. — 08Ray 04:29, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

I agree with making a note about it - as you said, most tonics do give brawl skills now, so any that don't are the exception, and we normally note exceptions like that. —Dr Ishmael 05:08, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

I was under the impression "no CB skills" means you have an empty skill bar, which is common with other sources of transforms.--Relyk ~ talk > 05:26, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

Not always the case. A few tonic transformations give you no skills at all, some give you only   Return (mostly the static forms) and most give you CB skills. It seems that the way ANet intended it now is that all tonics give you at least Return so you can leave the transformation aswell, but they forgot to add that in some cases. So I guess it's safe to say it's worth mentioning CB skills in heading (if any) or either only Return or no skills under Notes. — 08Ray 05:36, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

See the reason why I think we can omit the Return skill is because we have a few cases for transformations:

1. Tonics: Weapon skill bar is replaced with empty skill bar, you get a placeholder return instead of Return.
2. Tonic/Object transformation: Costume brawl skills replaces weapon skill bar, Return placed in healing skill slot. Objects include cauldron for example.
3. Toy: Costume brawl skills replaces weapon skill bar. Non-costume Brawl skills are available while not in Costume Brawl (Summon Familiar).
4. Effect: Transformations by other players or events, such as Moa Morph. You can't voluntarily drop out. Of course, we distinguish from Transforms as well, those just replace the skill slot with a placeholder return on the slot for most skills.

That's the pattern I see off of memory so might be all correct, but we can imply what type of transformation by the source. It then becomes more useful to describe how the transformations differ on the transformation page than imply that all transformations follow the same pattern. That's hard to imply by listing or not listing skills. Notes would be about exceptions, but I don't really see exceptions unless one of the variations are very unusual. I that whether you can jump or not different for any variation of the transformation, hence a note being a good idea.--Relyk ~ talk > 08:31, 13 January 2013 (UTC)

For as far as I know, these are all the different options for gaining a new model and/or new (CB) skills, specified by the appropriate category.

We could put the info about the different options from the appropriate category on the Transform, Transformation, Toy and Halloween 2012->interactive object pages. And then only mention the skills in a skill bar (without Return or Leave Form if present) on the specific pages if you gain more skills than just Return, otherwise we leave info about skills out. Also the info about how to gain CB skills on the CB page can be a bit more specific, like not just mention "some tonics" but specify the kind of tonic (BLC and MF tonics) and maybe even add a list of items that give you CB skills (linking to the Skills sections on the specific pages), in the same way we have a list of tonics on the tonics page and a list of miniatures on the miniature page. — 08Ray 16:13, 13 January 2013 (UTC)

Chat link codes

So yeah, in all likelihood, we'll be setting a SMW property for the item page that holds the item id. We can derive the chat link code from the item id. We can make SMW queries and generate plenty of tables from that. Meanwhile, everyone else gets to wait and wonder when we can get it implemented.--Relyk ~ talk > 17:58, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

Had to google SMW query first lol but that sounds great. Hope it won't take too long, because that would really add a whole new functionality to the wiki. — 08Ray 18:20, 11 January 2013 (UTC)