User talk:Konig Des Todes/Archives2

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Hello Sir

I don't know about you but I'm ready for all the juicy lore goodness that is imminent. Go go! Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ аІiсә User Aliceandsven 1.png ѕνәи Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ 05:20, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Don't you mean game mechanic goodness? :P This is the year of the game mechanics, the year of the lore has passed, though I hope it isn't only game mechanics we'll be getting information of. -- Konig/talk 15:13, 5 January 2010 (UTC)
Well that too. Though I was mostly referring to the secrets that are still with-held and all the loose ends from the first campaigns (like the cipher quests, the mursaat/seers, the gods/mists, etc). Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ аІiсә User Aliceandsven 1.png ѕνәи Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ 21:18, 6 January 2010 (UTC) Yes signature sucks, woops


In you summary it said "look at the end of the first sentence." I did, and didn't see anywhere where it mentioned that the Durmand Priory or the Order of Whispers were multi-racial or that they fought against the elder dragons, can that be added in there somewhere? Taros 02:03, 18 February 2010 (UTC)

"Durmand Priory is a monastery hidden in the Shiverpeaks that is maintained by monks who are part-scholar and part-fighter, and players will be able to join." and "The Order of Whispers is an ancient order which players will be able to join." What was removed was "It is one of the multi-racial orders which transcend racial agendas and face the greater challenge of the aforementioned Elder Dragons, along with the Durmand Priory and the Vigil." (or Order of Whispers and the Vigil). That is why I removed them (not to mention the sentence was redundant with multi-racial order and "transcend racial agendas". I added to the Order of Whispers article that they are fighting the elder dragons (or clarified, I should say), Durmand Priory is harder to work in, as it is both about a location and a group (I think that's going to need a split). -- Konig/talk 07:24, 18 February 2010 (UTC)
Yeah I agree with the bad wording, it was just copy pasting from the article and I mentioned in the summary to make it sound better, but anyway, I see that they include that now, thank you. I wasn't sure if "players can join" was enough to make it obvious that it was multi-racial and fighting the elder dragons. Taros 21:01, 18 February 2010 (UTC)


:D ArenaNet artists and various other artists have been donating art to this website for an auction. Now, I know this doesn't say GW2, but look: "A Dark Queen" -- Shew 22:55, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Looks like potential female Nightmare Court. -- Konig/talk 02:59, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
Ooo definitely. :D Very cool looking! ^_^ -- AmannelleUser Amannelle Me.jpg 03:35, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
I wonder why there are wolves in this concept art and the "Caithe" concept art. And they seem to have removed the art from the website. ><-- Shew 04:11, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

Background Template

Took a look at your background. You need to add a width parameter to the embedded table as well. Replace the third line in the template with this (I'd do it, but I got yelled at for changing people pages):
{| cellpadding="3" cellspacing="3" style="background: {{{background|#9FC}}}; width:{{{width}}};" colspan="2"
Mat Cauthorn, The Botanist 20:52, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, I'm terrible at coding and just borrowed the template from somewhere else, just changed the background color. Much appreciated. -- Konig/talk 21:14, 16 March 2010 (UTC)


Thanks for not welcoming me =P. How are you? xD --Naoroji User Naoroji Sigavatar.jpg 15:20, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

Thank you

I just wanted to rewrite it since it looked dull before, I have no idea how those parantheses got there though =X Taros 20:00, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

Naroji added them for some reason. -- Konig/talk 20:49, 19 March 2010 (UTC)
I did what? ;o. --Naoroji User Naoroji Sigavatar.jpg 21:25, 19 March 2010 (UTC)
All I've been doing is making some pages redirect as well as an edit on the Ascalon & Ascalon City articles. I don't even know what parantheses are? ;o --Naoroji User Naoroji Sigavatar.jpg 21:27, 19 March 2010 (UTC)
My bad, it was Neil. Darn all the N's... -- Konig/talk 22:04, 19 March 2010 (UTC)
If it helps, I'll change my name to my former gamer tag, Impulzz. Or are there then too many I's? xD --Naoroji User Naoroji Sigavatar.jpg 22:16, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

Hey, hey

, hey, hey, hey, my userpage isn't dead any more ;o. --Naoroji User Naoroji Sigavatar.jpg 12:31, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

Woot Anet used my idea

Hey Konig. check this out. Anet used my idea,,, so cool.
hehe, what you have to say about that? --Knighthonor 14:45, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

I don't mean to burst your bubble (I happen to love bubbles), but I doubt it was really "your idea" since it was most likely implemented or planned on being implemented before you stated it. Just like if someone randomly said "They should add jumping to GW2" and it happened, it wasn't THEIR idea, exactly. But on the plus side it shows you and someone working for ANet are like minded... or at least had 1 thought in common... lol 14:55, 29 April 2010 (UTC)
You suggested it in 2010, this year. I highly doubt they would of been able to get a working version of the skill bar within 2 months. Not to mention that I cannot make heads or tails out of your suggestion. They more than likely thought of that long before you did. So don't go bragging its your stuff just because you happened to get the same idea, which happens billions of times a year. -- Konig/talk 21:43, 29 April 2010 (UTC)
Yes and Anet scraped Dual Classes also. So I guess major changes can come by faster then expected huh?oh yeah almost forgot. LOL--Knighthonor 22:34, 29 April 2010 (UTC)
They said that they scrapped dual professions a long time ago. Far before you even joined Guru. Just because they announce it now, doesn't mean they made the changes now. And I was honestly expecting the dual professions to be scrapped. I really don't see why you get pleasure out of trolling me, because that's what you're doing... again. And all I asked was for you to leave me alone. Guess you can't be mature like I hoped. -- Konig/talk 22:42, 29 April 2010 (UTC)


Can you please stop editing them until consensus has been reached, just to avoid further conflict? Thanks. --User Phnzdvn sig.pnghnzdvn 02:42, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Didn't know there was a discussion, also I was trying to make them all the same. -- Konig/talk 02:51, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Personal attacks

This edit is completely inappropriate. I understand that Erasculio was being hostile, but escalating the hostilities is not an acceptable response. - Tanetris 08:05, 30 April 2010 (UTC)


I'd imagine we'd list the specific races skills on the race page, and then have the full list of racial skills on the racial skill page as well. ~ PheNaxKian talk 01:10, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

A request ^^

Hi Konig! I don't know if you've seen any of my concept races or not, but I was wondering if you could possibly help me modify them to make them more GW2 Suitable, based on what we know has been put into the game. :D You're really good with Lore (a skill I lack, sadly) and it would be a GREAT help if you could give correction, direction, suggestion, commentary, etc. :D So far the one I have posted is the Lyren, but I will soon upload Veridé, as well as Plenu'a. Please and thank you!! ^^ --AmannelleUser Amannelle Me.jpg 03:25, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

I dislike unoriginal ideas, and yours seem to be highly based off of fairies, though your first link wasn't bad. I'll look over it later. But I'm not one to enjoy just visuals. /endcomment -- Konig/talk 20:32, 4 May 2010 (UTC)
Of course. ^^ Yes, it is sort of based off fairies I suppose, as far as the physiology aspect goes (humanoid face and wings), but I personally don't recall seeing fairies with inverted legs, 3 fingers and 1 thumb on each hand, etc; but of course I haven't really studied much on fairies, so there may be something just like it out there for all I know. ^^ The first one, unfortunately, has been "used" by Perfect World, unfortunately. However, I'm wondering if it could be changed enough to be not only less like Perfect World's interpretation, but also more suitable for GW2 altogether. You're very welcome to check out the lore on that page and suggest how you think it should be different. :) --AmannelleUser Amannelle Me.jpg 21:19, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

I demand Fan Fiction!

I think i read something of yours on GW2G... I demand some GW2 Fan Fiction, due to the lack of information being produced, i'm suffering from GW2 withdrawal. Also, Club K are nubs. --User:Nautaut (t) 17:57, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

Impossible, my fan-fiction (which is being rewritten and will be updated on here as elsewhere) is on GW1G, and GWO. My GW2 fan-fiction won't be out for a long while. First book will be around the Exodus, second will be around the Scarab Plague, the third around Odran's time, the fourth around GW1, and the fifth around gw2. Also, Club Kickass. -- Konig/talk 20:42, 5 May 2010 (UTC)


I like your style of writing and the things you do for gw. I hope that I've not offended you and if I have (even hostile) I am sorry. You're a great person and I hope you continue to be an inspiration. I think several like your contributes and I know I do. Ariyen 22:55, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

Sea of Sorrows

"Resurgent trade between Cantha and the devastated Tyrian kingdoms formalized in the Second Treaty of Lion's Arch. Bay of Sirens is renamed Sea of Sorrows after an upswing in shipwrecks". From the official time line, that reads as saying that the upswing of shipwrecks was as a result of simply there being more ships because of the increased trade. It has nothing to do with Orr. In fact the Factions manuscript doesn't mention Orr at all. If the renaming had anything to do with the Cataclysm it would have said so. --hexalMy 18:19, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

"The Timeline doesn't say specifics." And think, what would the fall of Orr cause? Waves, and what do lots of waves cause? Shipwrecks. Common sense there. And what does the Factions manual has to do with that? The timeline, like all timeline, just says things. Also, it is two different lines, that means there doesn't need to be a connection. It is two events that happened in the same year. Trade resumed and the bay was renamed in the same year, that all that means. -- Konig/talk 18:41, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
Lemme pose anougther Pheroy, it was re-named due to the ships from Orr that were broken by waves and washed ashore kryta?--Neil2250 User Neil2250 sig icon5.png 18:44, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
But a sudden event like a the Cataclysm wouldn't cause an 'upswing', no one would say that. An upswing is gradual. They may be 2 different but no other reason is given. Factions is packaged on it's own as it's own game. The time line in the manuscript mentions the renaming but not Orr. If it were caused by Orr it would say so. You're reading something that isn't there. @Neil It's 'theory' btw ;) --hexalMy 18:51, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
If I am reading lines not there, then so are you. Also, upswing is "a marked increase or improvement". Doesn't say gradual, doesn't say sudden. In fact, those words are put before upswing if they are such. In other words, in this case, it could be either or. And there is another reason given. Orr's fall! Think, what would a sudden explosion and a new area to fill with water cause in the surrounding sea? Fast currents, dangerous waves, etc. And what do those cause? Shipwrecks. I highly doubt that there would be a dramatic increase of shipwrecks just because of an increase of ships - yes, there will be an increase, but enough to rename a bay? What's so sorrowful by a handful more of shipwrecks? What's sorrowful by an entire nation drowning and more than likely causing dozens of ships to be lost?
Tell me, which is more likely? A few more ships, or a catastrophe? -- Konig/talk 19:08, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
What a word means and how people use it can be very different. Ask anyone what 'bemused' means, they'll either be wrong or pedantic. I still don't believe it had anything to do with Orr. The factions manuscript says the bay was renamed, but nothing about Orr. Anyone who reads it would instantly understand it as saying it was because of the resurgent trade. If I'm wrong, the writer screwed up. But until someone from Anet says that it was because of Orr, I am unconvinced. --hexalMy 19:18, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
Why bother mentioning Orr in the Factions Manual which has nothing to do with Tyria. You're argument is terribly flawed. But fine, remove the orr/sea connection, but you have even less to back yourself up. The writer wasn't wrong, just not saying anything, and there's no need to explain why the sea was renamed, it was renamed and that's all that was needed to be stated. The only mention of the trade I see when looking for mentions of the rename was in the timeline, everywhere else, the rename was mentioned alone. -- Konig/talk 19:30, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
Then why bother mentioning the Bay at all? It would have even less to do with Cantha than Orr would. If it has nothing to do with the trade then why is it there? --hexalMy 19:36, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
Honestly, you're guess is as good as mine. But some Tyrian events were in that calendar. They probably just merged the two, adding in the trade note. Let me get my manuals and compare the Prophecies one to the Factions one. -- Konig/talk 19:38, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
Edit: Yup, if you look at the Prophecies manual, that timeline was added into the Factions one (with some rewording to make the calendar have completely sentences). The Bay of Sirens rename was in the first one and the second one, but the trade note is only in the Factions one. Thus, the trade was not relevant to Tyria and less likely to be the reason of the renaming. -- Konig/talk 19:40, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
Hmm. That it totally not how I would expect the full timeline to be interpreted. Oh well :I --hexalMy 19:45, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

I know

It is getting difficult to keep up with every change. I was surprised when I got back from holiday going back 500 RC edits barely got me past a day of changes.

I just wanted to step in between you and try to stop the angry replies from either of you. As I see it every argument needs two people to continue on. You and Eras are both valuable enthusiastic contributors with good, strongly held ideas. You both need to try to argue the point and not rise to any insult, real or implied, in the other's words. Especially as you now know you both tend to angrily disagree with each other.

I hate to see these arguments. You both care about making the wiki better - there are no sides and no disagreements in that. -- Aspectacle User Aspectacle.png 04:02, 11 May 2010 (UTC)


Regarding that specific point, Kt is right: it was mentioned by Eric Flannum that "there’s a channel skill which if you hold down will heal you". So we could say that an official source mentioned a channel mechanic. I'm not going to tell him about it or mention that on the (hopefully soon to be deleted) Channeling article, though. Erasculio 01:33, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

I Already know about it silly--Knighthonor 01:35, 18 May 2010 (UTC)
I don't read that as saying "channeling" is a type of method that blah blah blah.-- Shew 01:38, 18 May 2010 (UTC)
As I said on the Channeling talk page, "Channel skill"!="Channeling" - the name is still unofficial and such shouldn't be on the wiki, as Era said: "We don't know enough about that mechanic in order to make a full article about it, we don't know if it's not just part of a larger mechanic and thus better suited to be part of a larger article, and there's really no need to make an article for every word that comes from Arena Net's mouth." -- Konig/talk 01:38, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

That list...

So I've been really, really lazy. Do you still need the list of interviews not in your thread?-- Shew 20:37, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

I do but I'll be extremely busy the next few days. I'm out of town atm (shockingly enough this place does have internet) and will be unable to be on as often. -- Konig/talk 18:40, 20 May 2010 (UTC)
Here ya go. Were you able to catch the recent blog post?-- Shew 18:50, 20 May 2010 (UTC)
I just got on since Monday, so not likely. -- Konig/talk 18:54, 20 May 2010 (UTC)
:O ... then you missed the beta key giveaway! Fail; anyways, I can clean that list up. Just the ones with lore info, right?-- Shew 18:57, 20 May 2010 (UTC)
What are you talking about? I was here for the beta giveaway. :p Yes, just the ones with the lore info (and if you can copy/paste the lore questions/answers, that would be swell). -- Konig/talk 19:08, 20 May 2010 (UTC)
Updated-- Shew 21:15, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

Just thought you might want to see

I think ANet created this blog post specifically for us :P --Santax (talk · contribs) 22:54, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

While I think it's good they finally codified how to handle race names (hopefully ending the Charr vs. charr conundrum, among other things) I can't help but think that profession names should've remained capitalized for reasons of clarity. Arshay Duskbrow 23:07, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
Cool. Definitely aimed at us wiki people who argue too much about these things. :) -- Aspectacle User Aspectacle.png 23:24, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
"If you’ve made it this far, I’d like to extend a sincere thanks—to both of you." LAWL. Zolann The IrreverentUser Zolann The Irreverent Mysterious Summoning Stone.png 23:59, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

Watch out.Freind.

1.Guild Wars 2 Wiki:Copyrights ‎(1,522 links)

2.ArenaNet ‎(987 links)

3.NCsoft ‎(943 links)

4.User:Calor ‎(328 links)

5.User:Konig Des Todes ‎(304 links)

6.User talk:Konig Des Todes ‎(295 links)

7.User:Neil2250 ‎(272 links)

... Your Next. --NeilUser Neil2250 sig icon5 Anti.png 16:22, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Hmmm.-- Shew 16:25, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
About that. :p-- Shew 16:25, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
Place 64 for me. Go midrange! -- Cyan User Cyan Light sig.jpg 16:32, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
I'm catching up >;]. However, I think Calor needs to return in all his spam glory. xD --User:Nautaut /(t) 19:13, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
So I've commented on 304-295 pages huh? Interesting. -- Konig/talk 23:16, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
WHEEEEEERE can one see this D: --Naoroji User Naoroji Golem - Green.jpg 23:18, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
Here!!!-- Shew 23:43, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
Quite the prolific poster, my friend.--Corsair@Yarrr 23:47, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
W00tw00t, I'm nr. 10 =D Now for creating new pages in my userspace and leaving my signature,... MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. --Naoroji User Naoroji Golem - Green.jpg 08:32, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
I don't see what the big deal is >.> --Unending fear 13:55, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
That's because you're not even in the top 50 =3 --Naoroji User Naoroji Golem - Green.jpg 13:57, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
Because I don't spam stuff. Do you know how easy it would be to slip a <!-- ~~~~ --> in ever image I tag? I would shoot up so fast. I still don't see the big deal though. --Unending fear 13:59, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
I too don't see what the deal is, and I too don't spam. I discuss. Though at times what I discuss is in response to someone making needless comments (e.g., spamming). -- Konig/talk 20:44, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
haha im #49--♥Icyyy♥‎ 20:47, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
I Want to say this now, Nobody is nessiserily spamming in this game.nor are they aloud, or Scarecrow will... Inturupt. it is a fair. normal... fun? game all i know is. KONIG IS GOING DOWN. --NeilUser Neil2250 sig icon5 Anti.png 20:57, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

(Reset indent) Please take your roid rage and gtfo. I like my talk page silent, now get. *shoos you away with a broom* -- Konig/talk 21:31, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

I'm only 336 :'( guess i need to go add some random comments to pages like this one. Vald Tuesday User Valdimir newsigicon.png 21:36, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
.*Hisses like a cat and walks away sadly* Meowargh.--NeilUser Neil2250 sig icon5 Anti.png 21:39, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
'nd normal with the indents please.--NeilUser Neil2250 sig icon5 Anti.png 21:39, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
Vlad: Mission accomplished! --Naoroji User Naoroji Golem - Green.jpg 22:18, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
Go figure there would be a E Pen Contest on wiki with how many posts there are.. OH and Hey ya Konig KeLLiUser Kelli8421 SigPurplemusic.jpg 05:09, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
... *grabs cane and old-man glasses* GET OFF MY TALK PAGE YOU PESKY KIDS! Seriously, what's with the chatiness over here? It's unusual and getting tiresome with the "You have a new message" always appearing. >.< -- Konig/talk 08:16, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

Dociu issue

I hope it's solved now? D: --Naoroji User Naoroji Golem - Green.jpg 22:17, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

GW2 Character names

we can make Sylvari in the nightmare court??? AWESOME btw nice names Zachariah Zuan. 10:16, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

No, those are the character names for my fan-fiction, not just for GW2. The ones which are only for GW2 are those that have "Will name once made in GW2." -- Konig/talk 10:50, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
Edit: Which should be obvious considering I have Jormag, Grenth, "Unnamed Undead," and "Unnamed Fleshreaver" listed as well. -- Konig/talk 10:51, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
Don't be hateful Konig let the man dream. EiveTalk 11:48, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
touche, I saw GW2 characters, so I assumed, anyway, your a fanfic writter? awesome, me too Zachariah Zuan. 12:01, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
( I am too, but only minorly >_> ) --NeilUser Neil2250 sig icon5 Anti.png 12:02, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
The navbar having a link titled "Fan Fiction" should of made it apparent. Yes, most of it is red-links for now, but I intend to upload all of that (some are written, some are not; most are thought out, few are not). And I'm a writer. :P Just practicing/enjoying leisure with the fan-fiction. -- Konig/talk 12:27, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
You really are a writer? :O Nice. What do you write about? --Super IgorUser- Super Igor logo.png 12:56, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
More like writer-in-practice (haven't gotten anything published yet (nor have tried yet) outside of college magazines), and whatever I feel like - though most turns out gothic/pathos and fantasy/about angels and demons. I do have a large project on hiatus for the summer (on hiatus to try to get as much fan-fiction out of the way as possible as I hate unfinished projects). -- -- Konig/talk 13:49, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
Fantasy about Angels and demons? I dare say not erotic fantasy? :3 --Unending fear 16:13, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
I've managed to keep erotic out of my writings. It's closer to depression, pain, fear, madness, agony. I think my mind has spent a little too much time in my own Realm of Torment. Konig/talk 12:07, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
Ah, even better :3 --Unending fear 18:33, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
If you care to read, a few selected works of mine (I think they are the least depressing I have) can be found here. -- Konig/talk 18:42, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
Damn, Konig, those are great. O.O I want more. D: --Unending fear 21:36, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
Have you read the fan-fiction? Only 3 chapters (+prologue) out atm, and I release weekly on mondays. I'll be putting it up on the fan-fiction page every first monday of the month (just so I don't have to update so many things at once). -- Konig/talk 22:26, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
Mmmmm, no, links? --Unending fear 22:55, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
Do I need to do everything for you? Shesh, what a spoiled child you are. :P The GW2Guru link. -- Konig/talk 22:59, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
I am a spoiled child. ;-; I know too many people who have sometimes not even had anything edible at their house besides flour. D: Ah, but I digress. Thanks for the link. :) By the way though, what is that avatar you use from, it's very interesting? :0 --Unending fear 23:08, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
[1] from here. -- Konig/talk 23:25, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
Ah! Ok x3 --Unending fear 23:56, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
I dabble in alot, Erotic, Fantasy....Erotic Fantasy Zachariah Zuan. 07:23, 22 June 2010 (UTC)
... I think my talk page has been popular for too long. Move along now. -- Konig/talk 08:15, 22 June 2010 (UTC)
aww shame I was looking forward to discussing Lore with you Zachariah Zuan. 15:18, 22 June 2010 (UTC)


Seems like there "might" be dredge as per this image -> [2] located at [3] . Ariyen 05:16, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

What's this about might? We've known of dredge in gw2 for ages (since 2007), and there's been nothing to imply there wouldn't be dredge. Or am I missing something in what you meant? -- Konig/talk 05:42, 25 June 2010 (UTC)
Ah...O, I wasn't sure. :-S Sorry. I like looking at the concept art of gw 2. Ariyen 06:26, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Could you take a look at...

"Talk:Battle of Ascalon City", as some lore seem to be mixed over time. Corsair said to ask you, about this. Thank you. :) Ge4ce 19:31, 30 June 2010 (UTC)