Talk:Tonic

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Interacting with merchants[edit]

The article states "the player cannot fight or interact with merchants". Trying right now, and it seems that interacting with merchants is not a problem at all for me. Is this statement simply outdated, or does it vary depending on what type of tonic? Hakiki 18:37, 28 August 2012 (UTC)

Confirmed. I can easily interact with vendors while under the effect of a tonic. (192.168.104.82 20:42, 14 October 2012 (UTC))

Account Bound[edit]

Are you kidding me. Most of us hate tonics with the possible rare exception of a tonic or two that we use on occasion for the fun of it. Their only value in GW 1 was trade value. Please allow these to be traded. Pretty please. Flushing all these tonics just seems a waste. The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.72.180.173 (talkcontribs) at 11:01, 4 September 2012 (UTC).

I'm still curious what is the use of this mechanic in the game since it doesn't seem to have any advantages for the player? The preceding unsigned comment was added by Volted (talkcontribs) at 16:32, 6 September 2012 (UTC).
It has no use other than decorative purposes. It doesn't even have an achievement tied to it, which is odd. The preceding unsigned comment was added by 192.168.104.79 (talkcontribs) at 12:26, 8 September 2012 (UTC).
Me I'm going to store them in case a achievement becomes available for them. But then I only really play one character so I have extra slots available. This solution is a problem for those who want to play several characters Varuuth 13:58, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
Their purpose is to tie up storage slots on the off chance they might become an achievement, thus forcing the purchase of additional storage. :) The preceding unsigned comment was added by 184.148.112.190 (talkcontribs) at 08:13, 18 September 2012 (UTC).
Really I don't have a clue as to their purpose. The preceding unsigned comment was added by 184.148.112.190 (talkcontribs) at 08:14, 18 September 2012 (UTC).
That sounds like good reason to me >:( I love my pre searing tonics, this is just stupid. An account bound treasure coming out of a chest you probably had to buy a key for with gems is not incentive to me. I think I might just store the chests instead on the hope that one day they start offering more regular key drops.Wonderland 05:25, 22 September 2012 (UTC)
Let's practice some general wiki rules when posting on the discussion page. Use a colon (:) each time a new line is started, and always use one more than the previous line. I've edited the article to reflect this. Also be sure to sign your post by either clicking the Signature icon Button sig.png or by typing four tildes (~~~~). Also try not having break lines/empty lines between your text, which makes it looks like multiple people are responding. As for uses of this tonic, I have a couple of points in an achievement that lists "Consumed food" or something along those lines, and the only thing I've consumed were 2 or 3 tonics. So they may be tied to that. Further verification needed. --Kristofferus 03:01, 23 September 2012 (UTC)

Suggest rename to something like "Transformation Items".[edit]

While I like to use the name "Tonics" because of GW1, I feel new players might get confused. In GW2 there seems to be a huge volume of items that are not tonics in name at all but provide the costume effect, for example: Ghost_Owl_Feather In addition, there are quite a few tonic or "tonic-like" items that drop randomly in dungeons, so I think it's fair to change the "Almost All Tonics..." to "Many Tonics.."Kaynide.png 01:33, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

2.5 years later, yes, I agree with you. Players use the word "Tonic" when they communicate about transformation items in general, even if it's a "Tincture", "Potion" or "Truffle", but we could put a redirect from Tonic to Transformation Item. --Leen (talk) 20:58, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

More tonic[edit]

I got an "ursan tonic" The preceding unsigned comment was added by Yes4me (talkcontribs) at 18:53, 10 November 2012 (UTC).

Ghostly Tonic[edit]

I see an entry in the top table (rare section) for "Ghostly Tonic|Human Warrior". Can someone please explain why it's laid out like this? (I had one drop, and couldn't find it's name in the list, but in the editable list, it's there.) Daddicus 05:19, 14 January 2013 (UTC)

When I created the table I looked at the actual transformation the tonics gave instead of the tonic name because some are different. But I guess this can be confusing since it's a list of tonics and not a list of transformations. I'll change it ;) — 08Ray 10:12, 14 January 2013 (UTC)
Done— 08Ray 10:33, 14 January 2013 (UTC)

Deleted(?) Tonics[edit]

Does anyone know for sure that the Warm/Charged/Cold/Hard Potions are actually removed from the game? And what about some of the basic rarity tonics that we don't have a MF recipe for (e.g. Red Moa Tonic) but were in the game until 25/09/12? The patch notes don't specify what they did with these. I've asked for confirmation, but no response yet. Just can't imagine them deleting these for no reason. Also how will we handle deleted tonics? The potions are now removed from the list, but maybe we should make an expandable list of deleted tonics at the bottom (atm containing the Potions and unobtainable tonics)? — 08RayGame bug.png 23:30, 14 January 2013 (UTC)

They are not removed, or at least not completely. You can find Exotic versions of those tonics in the Orrian Jewelry Boxes, which are endless. Maybe the Rare versions are removed. Vahkris 17:10, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

No title/achievement?[edit]

Kinda surprised there's no party animal equivalent title or achievement for the single-use tonics, or do consuming these contribute to some other achievement that's just not been noted on the wiki? --Wolfie User Wolfie sig.jpg (talk|contribs) 14:59, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

Suggested re-structuring[edit]

I just went on a big tonic-hunt, using the wiki to find most of them. I'd like to share some thoughts on the tonic page's structure.:

Item Rarity[edit]

I'm not sure it makes sense to structure the tables by rarity - because the item rarity really doesn't mean anything in the context of tonics. Most of them are not open world drops, but are obtained from various merchants or crafted/forged. The item rarity information can of course be found on the individual tonic's own page, but for the tables, I'd ditch it.

Grouping by type[edit]

It's easy to see why town clothes tonics are in their own table. I assume all the "Special Events" tonics are in tables of their own because they don't drop in-game anymore (in contrast, the Dust Mite or Monkey King tonic, which were also introduced with a living story chapter, are in the overall "tonics" table. I think the page would be more readable if structured like this:

  • Merchant Tonics (tonics and other transformation items from Karma, heart and event vendors)
  • Special Merchant Tonics (tonics from laurel and guild commendation vendors)
  • Dungeon Tonics
  • Crafted & Forged (Mystery tonics and their derivations, ruminant tonic)
  • Misc. Tonics (Open world drops)
  • Town Clothes
  • Retired Tonics (a table for the tonics listed under "special events" - column A <name of release>, column B <tonic name>, column C <endless tonic name> ) - also Selfless Potion/Thoughtless Potion?

I basically made a table like that for myself and it made tonic-hunting much easier. The table also had information (in a single word) about acquisition, and a column for <accountbound/soulbound/none>.

If you agree that this would make the page easier to navigate, I'll get working on it, but give me your opinions first. :) --Leen (talk) 20:56, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

Sounds good! Personally, I find the current structure of the tonic page rather confusing and partly cluttered (particularly due to the increasing influx of tonics). Your proposed structure makes sense and should provide a sound overview of all tonics as well as help accessing the desired information easily (not to mention quickly). Regarding the sections you present, I would list tonics that drop from Black Lion Chests (such as the mystery tonics and their respective endless versions) under the category 'Misc. Tonics'. Further, 'Retired Tonics' might be a little bit misleading, considering that most of the tonics are still available through the trading post - perhaps 'Special Event Tonics' would do? Concerning the Selfless Potion/Thoughtless Potion, I believe they should not be listed on the tonic page, as they are gizmos. All in all, great idea! Inc (talk) 13:05, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
I was shying away from "Special Events Tonics" because some other tonics were also introduced with Living World chapters, but still drop in game. I'm not sure yet what I think is the best heading for such a section, but I'll think about it some more! As for Selfless Potion/Thoughtless Potion (as well as Ellen/Evon represenation buttons and Hylek potions) - aren't all endless tonics considered gizmos? So they could be both. Other than most gizmos, they do change the appearance of the character. Maybe I can list them at the end of the article in a little section for "not really tonics". :) --Leen (talk) 18:05, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
It seems I might have misunderstood the term 'gizmo' or rather missed reading its entry. I did not know that endless tonics are considered gizmos, and to be honest I am not overly fond of the term and this allocation. As tonics more or less change a character models appearance or parts of it (as in clothing in case of the clothing tonics), whereas the effects of Selfless/Thoughtless potions and/or representation buttons are not directly applied to the character model, I still think they do not belong on the tonic page - but that is just me nitpicking. Hylek potions however are an entirely different story. Those, and perhaps even the poly-luminescent undulating refractors, could be mentioned. Anyway, the draft on your userpage is looking very good so far! Inc (talk) 19:11, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
Gizmo is a "canon" item class, meaning the term appears ingame and in the API, so we can't really change that information up. Tonic on the other hand isn't, though of course it still needs a page/category for various reasons. How the page defines Tonic is up for debate. In the broadest sense (appearance altered/augmented) Ellen Kiel Representation Button (masterwork) could be considered a tonic, in the narrowest sense (model and skills replaced) Endless Casual Clothing Tonic would not be a tonic. Somewhere in between those. Tyndel (talk) 19:29, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
Tonics strictly gives transformation effects and you can only have one transformation at a time. A Representation Button simply gives an effect.--Relyk ~ talk < 19:35, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
So going by that Hylek Potions are not tonics. We can list them in the related items section maybe. Tyndel (talk) 19:43, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for the feedback so far! I think I am done with version 1 now. I'm not sure if this is the best possible way to present tonics, but I think it is an improvement at least. It's not easy to decide what is the best balance between "useful information" and "simplifying" and I'm sure everybody's opinion on that is a little different :) But if (or when) (I'm fairly optimistic) a "tonic wardrobe" functionality is implemented, it will be easy to show what is and what isn't (officially) a tonic. Until then, I will use what I have now and leave it in the wiki hivemind to come to a consensus. Next, I will go through the category:tonics to make sure I didn't miss any. --Leen (talk) 20:31, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
We can generate most of these tables dynamically (User:Relyk/SMW/tonic). The same can probably be done for the special vent and release tonics when they are organized properly.--Relyk ~ talk < 20:42, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
... ahhh :D Well, in that case, I hope the tonics page (as it is now) helps with the "proper organization" at least. I think it is complete for now. By the way, I messed up :( if you go to the Tonics category, you'll see that I accidentally added my own user page to it, and I can't get rid of it for some reason. The fancy sub page thing didn't work for me for some reason. And thirdly, I still dream of one big table with sortable headers that has all tonics, but with additional information such as endless yes/no; costume brawl yes/no; usable in combat yes/now; soulbound/accountbound/none; trading post price; etc. I'm done for now but that would have made tonic-hunting even easier! Maybe such a thing belongs on a mini website dedicated to tonic completion (similar to mini collection and dye collection checklists). --Leen (talk) 20:50, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
The wiki is far enough along most of that information like endless and costume brawl can already be generated, it would just be silly to put in one table. We can always add specific groups of tonics if someone finds it interesting. We got the user page removed from the category.--Relyk ~ talk < 00:18, 19 April 2015 (UTC)
Yes, I saw, thank you for fixing it <3 ! --Leen (talk) 16:22, 19 April 2015 (UTC)