Talk:Yao

Feedback 2023/12/10

I felt offended about the non-binary remark just as I imagine the author would be me making this comment. But the reason I feel like that has nothing to do with how people view their gender. GW2 is a game. Using a game to self-express feels "off" to me as in "not fair" to those that think differently or even are completely ignorant (all of which have equal rights to feel like the author of the remark does). So by using a game to express the importance of self-identification you are actually crossing a border from personal towards general. Using a wiki to do that is just a bit cheap to be fair. You don't need that to be happy about who you are I'd hope but if it helps you good for you just next time do it in a way that doesn't offend others preserving balance about how people think. And if you don't understand why it might offend others then there is something to learn still. Insisting a real-world claim on fantasy and implicitely on to the real world, so projecting a personal truth towards the view on truth of other people, feels very wrong as if vice verca if I was the author and I'd written Yao was male or female a cluster of people would actually feel offended they are not included once again. The difference in feeling offended is that one side is the major group viewing truth like that and the other is minor, so minor imposing on major isn't just semantics, it's identity being imposed on a much larger group, which is the border being crossed. Now I don't see a solution immediately because either side is always 'losing' somehow it seems.

And because of that it always leads to conflict.

I am not wise enough to know but it would help a lot to reduce conflict by simply engaging in balanced discussions rather then imposing anything at all.

Like it would be different if someone would approach me IRL saying they'd like to be called non-binary. Out of respect towards that person, if I feel like at least, it could lead to me call them non-binary but also male or female whatever feels right in that situation. Because that's related to a personal relationship, the context is quite different, open discussion can happen to prevent conflict for example.

But here is the hard part: discussing without projecting your own truth on the other is very very hard and requires maturing and self-reflection, something not everyone does equally. So as a result, conflict happpens anyway even if the starting intent is good. The only prerequisite for avoiding conflict is a stance of not-knowing and seeking understanding, which is exactly what a "claim" already forfeits. Ironically, this practice of not-knowing leads to true empathy and is a very identity-rich trait to discover, maybe even more then gender..

Lastly, I would never even have commented on this if it doesn't have something to do with me, but generally, I think I said something that holds true regardless of me as well, minor imposing on major or vice verca is less ideal then avoiding conflict and finding ways to be happy about who you are regardless. I believe it's very obvious to many what I'm saying, it just risks of being attacked and the question towards the author should be (in person) "why did you do this in a game / wiki rather then just finding balance in personal life" etc

You can delete this comment if you want to censor it, but it's a just criticism that asks for equal treatment in the end, ironically the same as what the author is trying to achieve I assume. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Javelias (talk) at 10:36, 10 December 2023‎ (UTC).

My problem with this thematic is, how it doesn't seem to fit in any of the world building. The sylvari are so well written and it fits perfectly that they have not distinct gender roles, as of their creation process. Yao just seems like a big marketing tool and is way to cliche (for my taste). The whole thematic got nearly no mentioning at all, but just when reallife politics and the Zeitgeist had their spotlight on it, it gets implemented in the game and handled like it was sth that existed in lore all the time. And every ingame NPC seems to be totally fine with it. We had many factions that were against female leadership (or even rights) from the beginning of the game, but noone ever ingame (as far as I know, please correct me) mentions sth against the concept of non-binary or gay people. Dont't get me wrong, I don't want to hate on these minorities or want to have them blamed in game, but It feels so off, that suddenly everybody just knew about it all the time and is totally happy and fine... that just does not feel realistic in any scenario where there are so many different races and cultures involved. (I am no native speaker and I hope that I didn't phrase anything wrong, that may be taken offensively, because that isn't my intention)--Aylia (talk) 11:05, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

Your objections to nonbinary people existing in a video game are noted, are wrong, and nothing will be done about them. Thanks. - Tanetris (talk) 15:41, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

In case anyone else somehow missed it, the clue is in the lead quote "...mostly friendly agender engineer." -Chieftain Alex 18:54, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

To be clear, these aren't my objections to nonbinary people existing in a video game, I wrote specifically about Guild Wars 2 and the way of implementation. I know that nothing will be done about this, and I don't ask to. Still love this game and will do.--Aylia (talk) 23:42, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

I didn't read your message as objection to nonbinary, from your very first sentence it was clear you made an interesting point of world lore also being relevant. So being interpreted as having a objection is regrettable but leave it with the other person. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Javelias (talk).