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Talk:Malchor's Leap

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[edit] Cypress Patch

i've notice around the Theater of Delight (not really) close to the POI Rayhan Bayt theres a group of Cypress saplings.its near a Melandru statue. if your server hasn't controlled the Melandru temple then your gonna be ripped to shreads by the brambles.----torqueblue 12:48:53 (UTC) 10/03/2012.

[edit] Locations

This table format offers nothing extra over a simple list as used in Karst_Plains, and it has the disadvantage of limiting the width of text to box size. Someone's getting carried away by style over functionality. The wiki should first of all be functional, and only secondly adorned for style. Morgaine 18:03, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

It doesn't need to offer any more than a simple list. The details will be on the individual locations' articles. Area pages will be containing the information for how to get to Vistas as well (something your example will outright lack). This design was agreed upon here to have rather than a simple bullet point list of locations, or (worse IMO), a separate section for each type of location-by-area. Konig/talk 19:12, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
To get technical it offers the possibility to sort after area and effective level, which I think is pretty handy. But yeah it was a heated discussion until we came up with this design. It is basiclly a mix out of table and list. Some wanted more of a list others more of a table and as Konig said to sort everything after Location type instead of area was also a suggestion that came up. - Yandere Talk to me... 20:19, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
Fair enough, you've given it some consideration. But it's not all perfect yet, as it stands. For example, I initially added "Statue of Melandru" to a skill point entry (because that is exactly how it's called in-game, and the point of the template is to avoid duplicating "Skill Challenge" everywhere) but discovered that it linked to a statue in Divinity's Reach by the same name, because names are not unique in the world. So I ended up prefixing with "Commune with" as others have done, despite this being our own invention rather than in the zone. Looks to me like the template needs to put names into per-zone namespaces, effectively becoming "Melchor's Leap/Statue of Melandru". Morgaine 21:28, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
That is an entirely diffrent problem and pretty common for all wikis, and has not much to do with the layout.
The one article that already exists should be called Statue of Melandru and the other one Statue of Melandru (skill challenge). Both articles get a Template:Otheruses which links the two article together.
In the table you would than right :{{map icon|skill}} [[Statue of Melandru (skill challenge)|Statue of Melandru]]. We do this quite often here. Hope that helps. - Yandere Talk to me... 21:38, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
With that I agree, but it's not what people are doing. I'll go back and tack "[Skill challenge]" onto the end of my last addition, which then becomes exactly as in-game. Morgaine 22:08, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
(Edit conflict) Thing is about the "Statue of <god>" objects is that there's dozens of them. There's one per god in Divinity's Reach, there's a Grenth one in Lornar's Pass, A Melandru and a Dwayna one in Wreckage of Serenity, a Statue of Dwayna in Ruins of Holy Demetre, and probably about 15 statues of five gods throughout Orr, then there's also the Statue of Dwayna NPC that's tied to the Cathedral of Zephyrs meta event. This, as Yandere said, isn't a fault regarding the location table or format. This is merely because there's so many objects of shared names, and we haven't yet documented any of these outside the Divinity's Reach statues. Though it's a question whether we want to merge or separate all these statues, as in total there's only 3-4 differing texts and 3-4 different models; either way, it'll be quite troublesome (moreso if we separate - because simply adding (skill challenge) to the end won't work since there's at least 2 Statue of Melandru skill challenges (one in Cursed Shore, one in Malchor's Leap), and I believe 3 Statue of Balthazar skill challenges (2 in Straits of Devastation, one in Malchor's Leap - not to mention the other god statue interactive objects). It's just something we'll have to figure out as we continue to document, however - once more, this is not a fault of the location listings, but rather that we're still documenting things.
On a side note, I hope to remove all the "Commune with <object>" and "Eat/Drink <item>" as they were created in mimicry of the fighting skill challenges which actually have event names.
Edit: It shouldn't be brackets, but parentheses. Konig/talk 22:13, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
I agree with all of this. I followed Yandere's advice above and it resulted in an incorrect page reference because there's another "Statue of Melandru (Skill Challenge)" as you've noted. I've left it like that for now until the correct course is decided. At least it's notationally correct, despite linking to the wrong page. Morgaine 22:17, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
I should point out that my interest in all of this (as it was in GW1) is to make the wiki informative, so anything that stands in the way of giving information is bad. I wanted to place distinguishing location info in the location box initially, because that is closest to the spot where the information is needed and avoids continual to'ing and fro'ing between pages. But I'm happy with any other approach as long as the required info is easily found. Morgaine 22:22, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

(reset) I think it would be good to have just one page "Statue of Melandru (Skill Challenge)" and simply list all location where you encounter this particular skill challenge. I am not a fan of the "Statue of Melandru (<zone name>)" because as Konig mentioned there are two statues of Baltazar in Straits of Devastation and at last at this point, we have to ask ourself if we want to have one skill chellange by article or if we allow more of these on one page. If we go with the second option I would put all identical skill chellenges together. AFAIK the Statues are the one skill chellenges which are affected by this, due to the temple mechanic, which I think is another reason to keep these on one page. - Yandere Talk to me... 23:10, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

I've started up a discussion on this at Guild Wars 2 Wiki talk:Projects/Project Cartography, though not on how to name the statue articles. I'd much prefer just having 1 article with a gallery at the bottom for the various statues, but it's troublesome for denoting which are skill points. For those where there's more than one statue per zone, just change to area name - for the time being at least, that's what I'd do (there seems to only be 2 cases of a statue being in two in one zone - Balthazar in Straits of Devastation and Melandru in Cursed Shore). If we merge all skill challenge statues together, there's one issue: the second statue of Balthazar is not tied to the temples, and is of a different model, it's located at the temple of Balthazar and replaces the Altars skill challenges that're at the other temples. And even then: how do we treat the others? For the example of Statue of Dwayna - there's Divinity's Reach, Demetre, and Serenity Temple, each has a different model, different text, and even different purpose (Demetre one - if you kneel at it, you spawn a ghost which can, in turn, start an event). Konig/talk 23:48, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
Well that's precisely the reason why I think it's a very poor idea to have a single article listing everything that shares a common name. The common name is not the point of the description, it is merely coincidental. The point is the actual object being described, which is different in each different location, even if it does share some properties with other objects of the same kind. If you're interested in (say) a particular skill point object because you've spent a day trying to find it and failed, then you first locate the zone page, then the area section in that page, then the skill point link. Why should this link take you to yet another generic page where again you have to find the zone and possibly the area? It breaks the search paradigm of progressively narrowing your set of objects examined, and also bloats the common page with multiple descriptions (because the settings all differ) and ancillary information, tactics and other advice. The bloat will undoubtedly end up calling for article split, so in due course we'll end up exactly where we should have been all along which is to have a single target page for each object linked from the zone objects box. That would be the right way to do this, factoring out to a shared page only those attributes of the object which are common to all. That way your search drills down monotonically towards the exact object you want, and only climbs back up into another search tree if your interest is in generalities. Morgaine 14:19, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

I can confirm the Doric's Shrine POI does indeed exist even though it can barely be moused over in game, even at full zoom (have to aim just west of the waypoint with your cursor). It is directly underneath Doric's Waypoint, and as such can be gained by standing under the waypoint or porting to said waypoint. I can confirm this with a screenshot if necessary. I'll go ahead and try updating the page for the waypoint to help those like myself who may not strafe directly under every waypoint but rather get just close enough and miss this POI. FBueller 00:09, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

Also, would the sneakiness of Doric's Shrine not really showing up on the map reliably warrant a note to that effect on the Malchor's Leap page? FBueller 00:24, 21 November 2012 (UTC)
It warrants a note to that effect on the Doric's Shrine page.--Relyk 00:28, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

[edit] How to reach?

How to arrive at Malchor's Leap from Straits of Devastation? Paladinofmm 05:58, 12 November 2012 (UTC)

You enter from Sentry Steppes, which has Sentry Waypoint nearby. It is directly west of there. Puk 03:49, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

[edit] Pyrite Peninsula

There is a spot, just south of the Skill Point Challenge on Sharktooth Island where I fell in, and couldn't get out. Using the waypoint close by to travel didn't work, as it would charge me but teleport me nowhere. I logged, and nothing. Had to go to PvP isles to get out of this rut, as /stuck did nothing to help. Beware! --Kristofferus 17:58, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

It's a trap!--Relyk ~ talk > 20:03, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

[edit] Vista in the garden

This one has me stumped. I come past every couple of weeks and spend ages looking for how to approach this vista. Deserves a mention somewhere, as there is not a page for Garden of Ilya. Puk 03:52, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

gimme a sec--Relyk ~ talk > 05:03, 7 March 2013 (UTC)
You have to go past the Memory of Dhuum's Last Stand skill point, there's a doorway to the east. Go up the stone ramps, and right before you exit to the cathedral, there are some holes in the right-hand wall. Jump through one of them, then jump your way back to the west until you reach the giant stone ring. Then it's a matter of not getting knocked off by the damn spectral juggernauts. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 06:16, 7 March 2013 (UTC)
Made the Garden of Ilya page and added a walkthrough, also with an image walkthrough.--Relyk ~ talk > 07:50, 7 March 2013 (UTC)
FYI, your walkthrough was deleted, apparently because someone else believes the vista should be considered a part of Blighted Arch. While that's not really a big deal, it IS a big deal that there is now direct disagreement between this page (which lists the vista in Garden of Ilya) and the pages for Blighted Arch and Garden of Ilya. I believe someone with more experience in resolving editing disagreements should check on that. I'd do it myself but I'm afraid of an edit/revert war because I edited "the wrong one". 68.82.210.93 23:13, 12 April 2013 (UTC)
My maps are accurate, it's in the Garden of Ilya (although the path to it starts in Blighted Arch). I haven't gotten around to updating all zone/area pages yet. —Dr Ishmael User Dr ishmael Diablo the chicken.png 00:33, 13 April 2013 (UTC)
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